Join hosts Jason (@DropTheMaskPod on X) and Mark (@MarkSeanPuls on X) in the uproarious “If By Whiskey” podcast, where sharp political satire meets side-splitting impersonations! This episode features special guest Jesse (@Jejune_Sun1 on X), as they dive into the wild world of politics with spot-on impressions of Donald Trump, Shri Thanedar, Jordan Peterson, RFK Jr., and more. Expect fiery debates, witty banter, and laughs that hit harder than a double shot of bourbon. Tune in for a podcast that’s equal parts insightful and unhinged!
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Transcript:
(0:32) Welcome, welcome, welcome everyone to another If By Whiskey. (0:36) Hello. We got a guy right here, Jesse.He’s joined us today by Jesse. Yeah, I’m Jesse. (0:43) We got breaking news, guys, from back east.Breaking news. This just happened. I have to (0:47) play this before we start.We’ve already got a couple people on. This just happened. Breaking (0:51) news from my hometown of Delaware County, Philadelphia.Let’s do this. Can you tell us (1:01) what happened? The lady chased me. She chased me and I asked her not to attack me.That is 44-year-old (1:08) Christina Solometo being put into a Prospect Park police car. But you may know her by this (1:14) now viral video. Police say the Ridley Park mother is the woman seen getting out of her car (1:22) and, yes, defecating on the hood of the car of another woman.She’s seen getting right back (1:29) into her black Nissan we saw parked outside of her home tonight. They were both headed in the (1:34) same direction. They both lived not far from one another.And the woman in the dark colored car (1:41) thought the woman was following her, which was actually just going home. The incident happened (1:45) Tuesday evening near the corner of 4th and Madison, half a block away from a Little League field where (1:52) the Delco defecator video has left some neighbors speechless. (1:58) I don’t know.It’s been running through my mind all day since I’ve heard about it. (2:03) Just another day in Delco. Solometo was booked on charges including indecent exposure, disorderly (2:09) conduct and a misdemeanor depositing waste on the highway.As she was getting arrested, (2:16) Solometo says, I have a sickness. She didn’t elaborate on the sickness, but the bizarre case (2:22) has now gotten international attention. Not the kind this police chief wants.It can’t happen in (2:28) this community. No town wants this to happen in their town. I mean, you know, the recognition (2:33) a town gets over this kind of thing.It’s really unwelcome. We don’t want this. (2:40) The Delco defecator.That’s fantastic. (2:43) Welcome to Philadelphia over there. I got a sickness.I can’t help it. They started chasing (2:48) you over there after I started taking a shit on a little car. (2:52) I like how they referred to it as depositing waste on the highway.(2:57) I am. I’m going to have to write you a ticket for depositing waste on us. (3:03) I’m going to sidewalk over there.(3:08) I’d still take Philly over Portland, man. Portland is nuts. Yeah, Philly and Portland.(3:15) Philly’s got more murders though. (3:18) I dare you to find a car that someone hasn’t take a shit on in Portland. (3:24) Yeah, it’s poodoo doughnuts now, right? (3:28) So welcome, Jesse.You are our honored guest to a brand new show. I understand that you are a (3:33) graduate, my friend. I’m about to graduate, yes.(3:37) Congratulations. College grad. Congratulations.That’s awesome. (3:41) Bachelor of science in political science. Coming up this fall, I’m going for a master’s in (3:50) international relations.(3:52) Nice. (3:53) So you are actually an expert. We can rely on you for your opinions because (3:58) you have the proper credentials.(4:00) Well, you know what? That’s subjective. (4:04) Have you been to the university? If you’ve not been, if you’ve never been to the university, (4:10) how could you get a degree? (4:13) I’ve got a bachelor’s. A whole bachelor’s of science.I mean, bachelor of arts in English. (4:20) I speak it. (4:22) So you wanted to jump on, my friend.We wanted to have you. I heard there’s a story. I’ve got (4:27) a story that you guys got to share with me.Something about LP National and Jason turning (4:33) into Hulk mode and you having to hold him back. (4:37) That’s a little hyperbole. (4:39) Yeah.(4:40) Could you guys share what happened? LP National? Because I heard so many stories. I’d just love (4:45) for you to hear you guys share some story about that. (4:47) Oh, God.(4:48) It was a wild weekend. (4:51) The last night of voting was a very late night. Things were just going to shit.Nothing was going (4:57) our way. People were upset, understandably, and Jason was very fucking upset. Honestly, (5:08) I felt like I was just playing the counselor.I was walking around trying to make everybody (5:14) feel better about how fucking horrible it was. (5:18) You were calm, cool, and collected. (5:20) I was trying to have a very positive attitude about the whole thing.Even though deep inside, (5:26) it was fucking hurting. (5:27) I was flipping over tables, setting fire to the paper. Yeah, it was bad.(5:35) Neither of you guys, I’ve met both of you once each, and neither of you guys I’d want to mess (5:40) with. I can only imagine Jason going to 11 and trying to, I don’t even know if I could be like, (5:48) dude, calm down. Hulk smash.Aren’t you 6’3″? You’re 6’3″, 6’4″, right? You’re a big dude. (5:55) 6’4″, yeah. (5:59) Yeah.I don’t remember it quite like that. (6:02) All right. I remember saying like, fuck, I’m done with this.I’m done with this LP thing. (6:07) I know you left at one point and then you came back. I remember that.(6:11) I was hungry. That was just me being hungry. I had to go eat.(6:16) How hungry did you eat? You had to feed yourself. (6:19) We went to 2 a.m. voting on some stupid shit. We went seven rounds of voting on the (6:26) presidential candidate, which turned out to be Chase.I don’t know, man. (6:33) He chased everybody out of the party. Look at that.Who knew? (6:36) He chased everyone out. No, I don’t think he did. I think Angela did more of that at this point.(6:41) Thanks. I think it was sabotaged to be honest. I’m looking back at that and it just seems more (6:47) systematically done purposely.I know it sounds weird, but it doesn’t not line up. It’s not like (6:53) it just happened. The stuff was put in place and mistakes were made during that night.(6:58) I watched it live from my chair in Arizona. I’m like, wait a minute. That’s not right.(7:03) You don’t go next candidate versus NODA. You keep going till you have a single candidate. (7:08) All of it was just weird, but whatever.Mistakes were made. You should have (7:12) nominated Donald J. Trump. Speaking of Trump.(7:18) Oh, go ahead, Jesse. You were saying? (7:19) At one point I voted for Mad Dog. He’s on X. I told him I’d vote for him.He’s cool as shit. (7:28) I voted for him during the vice presidential vote. (7:33) Was he there? (7:34) No, he wasn’t.I posted it on X just to show him I voted for him. It’s in the voter thing. (7:42) There was some funny ones in there.(7:45) Didn’t the guy who wrote, “‘Cause I Got High,” got one vote in the first round? (7:50) Yeah, yeah. (7:52) What’s his name? I forget his name. He wasn’t at the LP national, right? Anyway, (8:01) we got you gentlemen in today.We got a couple things on. I just heard Trump (8:05) make an instant impression here, an instant entrance. It made me think, (8:11) Jason, who was Trump’s old guy? The guy who used to run with him? (8:17) His old vice president.I can’t remember his name. (8:19) Pence, Mike Pence. (8:20) Pence, that’s right.Wasn’t there something going on? Didn’t something happen with him recently? (8:25) He just got an award. A major award. (8:30) Oh, a major award.(8:32) Yes, for Valerie under fire. (8:36) For Valerie. What’s this major award about? (8:38) For the, yes, putting himself in grave danger for the people that wandered in to the Capitol (8:46) building on January 6th and got a guided tour of the facility.(8:52) He took a bullet for the team. (8:54) Yes, yes. (8:56) All right, so everyone, welcome.We’ve got 15 people on today. We’ve got an If By Whiskey. (9:01) We are not doing the Woke Rite part three, even though James Lindsay just got together (9:06) with Jordan Peterson, which I think is like anti-matter and matter meeting at the same time.(9:11) I’m just, I’m over it. I’m over it. But you have joined us- (9:15) You know we’re going to do that.You know we’re going to do it. (9:18) I have my own takes on it, okay? If you’re interested, I’ll- (9:23) We’re going to talk about it. (9:24) So we are here right now.Let’s get your take. We’re here with Jess. (9:27) Jesse’s our special guest tonight on If By Whiskey.Jesse, welcome. (9:31) Tell us your take on this thing, man. (9:33) Well, first of all, Angelo did not chase me out of the party.I actually moved up. (9:43) I am now the chair of Pinot County. I just got voted in a couple months ago.(9:48) Nice. Congratulations. (9:49) Try to make some changes here.(9:57) Okay, so you’re in the party. What got you there, I want to ask? (10:03) What, like when did you decide, hey, I’m going to join the LP? I’m going to go, (10:08) actually go and be part of it and do the delegate thing and be a chair of the county? (10:15) It happened during the 2020 election. You know, my whole life, I had been a pretty, (10:25) well, at least I thought I was like super conservative, you know, or Republican or whatever.(10:32) I didn’t really know. Like, when I was young, I was very much like punk rock, like into like, (10:40) you know, anarchism or whatever, probably thought communism was cool. But, you know, (10:45) I joined the army when I was 19.I’ve spent 18 years, I spent 18 years in the army. And, (10:54) you know, in 2020, I was, what was I doing? I was on like Twitter, and freaking Ben Shapiro (11:07) posted something about economics was like, if you want to understand a little bit more about (11:12) socialism, you should totally read some of these books, you know? And I was like, okay, you know, (11:17) the first book I picked was by Mises called Socialism. And after reading that book, (11:26) I felt like my whole personality, my whole life, like everything I understood was a lie, (11:34) that the Republican Party was a lie.And that, you know, they were so quick to call everybody (11:42) socialist, and them being socialists themselves, like, it was really strange. But my whole world (11:51) be broke. And so then I started looking around, I was like, I don’t really know.And I ended up (11:57) finding Mac. And, you know, Mac, right? Yeah, he was just the chair of the Arizona Flavor Chain (12:06) Party. But I ended up finding him through like the Mises Caucus and hooked up with them and (12:14) just kind of like, went down that path and realized, like, holy shit, like, I’ve always (12:19) been a libertarian.Like, I just kind of, you know, I just didn’t know it. And then, (12:28) as time went on, I just became a little bit more and more extreme in my views about libertarianism. (12:33) You know, I am very much an anarcho-capitalist in like, every sense of the word.(12:42) How long’s that time from when you cracked? Because I think you and I have a very similar (12:48) path. Because I was like, an Iraq, Afghanistan guy. Well, you know, like, there were, there were, (12:53) like, it’s been a long time, really.But from, I would say from 2020 to now, (13:00) uh, that was about, like, what? So, 2025. So, yeah, about five years, five years to go. (13:07) That’s not that long, if you think about it, man.You’ve been an adult way, like, for 20 some years, (13:11) 20, you know. So, it’s, yeah, that’s not, it goes quickly, right? Once you start, once it starts, (13:17) you start finding the right literature, it really does. (13:20) But the transition is very real for me.Like, and it’s, it’s like an emotional thing. It’s (13:29) emotional. It’s, it’s, um, you know, like, it was hard to be like, oh, you know, (13:37) I’m not a fucking conservative.I’m not Republican. Like, you know, and then to like, (13:43) what is it called? Uh, you know, cognitive dissonance, right? Like, it, it was hard at first, (13:49) because, um, everything that I kind of, like, fell into turned out to be a fucking lie, you know, (13:57) like, or it turned out to be wrong, you know. Um, there were a couple little things here and (14:01) there that, you know, I may have agreed with, but for the most part, I was like, holy crap, (14:07) you know, so.Yeah, man. I think all of us here have kind of been through that. Yeah, definitely.(14:15) Like, for me, yeah, coming out of being, like, a soft conservative, I would say, like, I never (14:21) really liked identifying with that group, because I just hated a bunch of people in there that can (14:26) also were in that group. But then, once I discovered these libertarian things, it’s like, (14:31) it’s like a tingling in your body. You’re just like, oh, my God, yes, this is, this is it.(14:36) Yeah, it’s like, it’s, it is because it’s like this new awakening, because it’s like, it’s, (14:44) it’s the right feeling. It’s like, you know, it’s like, when you know, you’re onto something. (14:49) It’s, it’s literal epiphany.It’s like, I don’t like all the things that are kind of in the back (14:54) of your head, like, that’s, okay, I kind of like this, but it’s not quite right. And then somebody (15:01) like Rothbard or Mises puts it all together. And you’re just like, oh, yep, that’s it.(15:08) And once again, that crack happens quickly. You know, I mean, it’s just five years is not a long (15:13) time to have a completely shift in ideology, not from the right, not from the right to the left. (15:18) Remember, the right and the left are the same thing.We both, we’ve all agreed that any use (15:23) of government is statism. Statism is the problem, regardless if it’s socialist or fascist, (15:30) it’s the state using the power, the centralized power. So we’re, we look at this and now we’re (15:36) finding that like, that’s not working, right? It just doesn’t work.So we don’t want to give (15:40) anybody that power because we realize that it’ll be used incorrectly at some point. (15:45) And we’re trying to get people to see that same thing we’re starting to see ourselves, you know? (15:51) Well, tell me, tell me about the party. Tell me about why you chose to stick around.(15:58) Is there any reason why I should come back and join up again? (16:06) Well, I chose to stick around because I feel like the message is more important than the (16:15) constant infighting and the, like, I mean, people are different. One thing I learned, like, (16:22) going through school and stuff, and I kind of, like, come up with my own opinion about it, (16:27) but, like, with the political compass and stuff is that, like, you, it’s really hard to just, like, (16:35) pigeonhole people into, into, like, specific corners, you know, because everybody’s an (16:39) individual. And at the end of the day, like, people are very, like, interested in their own (16:45) problems first before they’re interested in, you know, the group’s problems or, you know, (16:53) the collective problems.And because of that, like, I think it would be, it’s important to, like, (17:02) I guess, have a, what do you call it, like, a soapbox to stand on and, and just, like, (17:12) try to connect with everybody in a way that is individual to them versus, you know, a collective, (17:23) a collective idea of what the libertarian party is supposed to be. And yeah, so, like, (17:29) the reason I stayed in is because, like, I want to do it my own way, basically. (17:33) Through the party, I can still bring up that conversation, right? Like, yeah, I’m the chair (17:38) of Pinal County, and let me tell you about this, you know, and whatever ideas match or whatever (17:47) ideas fit with your, you know, the way you feel about things, like, you know, I’m going to accept, (17:52) like, we can accept that, you know.So I think there’s hope for the party. (18:00) All right, all right. Well, the meetups are fun, anyway.(18:04) Yeah. And it’s got to have some social aspects to it, does it not? (18:10) I feel like the social aspect, because I talked to Andrew Heaton about this, about the tribal stuff, (18:15) like, if the libertarians want to be successful, they got to create something where people (18:19) actually want to come to. And the convention’s kind of fun, really, like, aside from having to (18:25) sit there and watch all the nonsense, like, fighting back and forth, but the convention’s kind of fun.(18:30) And if you go to things like the Liberty, or what is it, Liberty Con, or Pork Fest. (18:37) What’s the one in California this year you keep asking me to go to? Freedom Fest. (18:42) Yeah, Freedom Fest.If you go to that stuff, it’s just, like, hanging out with people who are (18:47) like-minded, and watching cool speakers, and meeting people, and it’s really, it’s a good time, right? (18:54) So that part of it’s great, but when you get into the voting, and the back and forth, and the (18:59) bickering, it’s just, oh, it’s painful. Yeah, yeah. And I think, I think a lot of us love the ideas, right? (19:06) I think we love the ideas, the thoughts of it, and then we’re like, look, these ideas are sound, how (19:12) come we just can’t implement them? Well, that’s because you have other people who are using other (19:16) things to manipulate you, not using, and that’s where we go, that doesn’t make sense.That’s like, (19:21) that doesn’t make logical sense. Why do we have to manipulate you into convincing you that logic is (19:26) the better way to go? Like, it’s, it’s so weird. It, like, becomes a circular thing almost.Well, (19:31) it’s in the messaging, too. Like, I mean, okay, yeah, we have extreme views, but if you’re going (19:37) to meet with somebody who’s, like, super statist, right? Like, you can’t start the conversation off (19:42) with, like, I think drugs should be legal for everybody, you know? Especially if they’re, like, (19:47) super conservative, or they’re like, fuck you, go away, you know? Yeah, you could start with, like, (19:52) smaller things, and then lead to that, because, like, I found that the reason that I shifted (19:59) was those small, was first, like, the more simple topics, right? It kind of, like, pulled me in (20:06) to, like, re-examine, you know, how I felt about everything else, (20:11) and then I noticed myself shifting towards the libertarian side, so. (20:18) Yeah, for sure, it’s the little things.Oh, Justin says, state is the power and the problem, (20:24) 100% agree. Maintaining a civil society as it grows and preventing a new state from forming (20:31) is the impossible problem to solve. So, where does that leave us? I mean, I don’t disagree.(20:39) State, you know, state power is a problem. For any value that it brings in, kind of, (20:46) creating a civil order, you’ve got to deal with a hell of a lot of other problems that I think are (20:51) worse. Yeah, I mean, the hard part is, like, as, you know, the individual, right? Like, (21:01) trying to convince society to have a moral belief system that matches with everybody, right? Like, (21:09) we all agree that there will be no state, you know, because you have to have everybody on the (21:16) same page morally, or it just doesn’t work.And that’s something that I think it’s hard for a lot (21:22) of people to wrap their heads around. I’ve been in arguments with other anarchists and think (21:27) that, oh, it’s just going to work, you know? And, yeah, I mean, it doesn’t work that way, (21:36) because everybody has to be morally accepting of that value of, you know, a stateless society, (21:44) like anarchism, and that everybody’s willing to work together towards that goal. (21:50) But individuals are individuals.So, like I said, the hard part is trying to stamp down, like, (21:57) where or what you’re going to do about that, you know what I’m saying? Like, (22:03) because you also don’t want to infringe on their ability to be individuals. So it’s kind of, (22:10) you know. Yeah.Well, it’s kind of interesting. We had no idea which direction we were going to (22:14) go about this, but considering we’re kind of talking about this right now, (22:19) this is probably actually a good point to play this one clip about Jeffrey Sachs. (22:23) This must be a recent conversation, right? Because he just spilled the beans about some COVID thing (22:29) that we’re going to share later, and then he has this as well.So let me play this clip, guys, (22:33) about this is kind of the governance we’re talking about, but it’s weird. Like, Jeffrey (22:38) Sachs is one of these weird guys where I don’t know what I feel about him yet. Like, I know that (22:43) Horton gave him grace for the thing.I really do think he tried to help Russia, and I don’t think (22:48) they took his advice, and I really, but he got embroiled with being part of that whole, you know, (22:53) the shock therapy in the 90s that really ruined Russia’s economy. So Jeffrey Sachs, a kind of (22:59) interesting individual. Let me play this clip about governance, and then we’ll get your thoughts (23:02) on that, Jesse.All right. And there’s one other concept that I, and there’s one other concept (23:13) that I find very, very useful, and it’s actually embodied in the European idea. It came from the (23:20) Catholic Church originally, but it’s called subsidiarity.And the idea of subsidiarity is, (23:28) let’s get real. We need governments at all levels. We need a global government, that’s the UN.We (23:36) need a regional government, that’s the European Union. We need a national government, that is (23:41) the government of Cyprus. We need a local government, that is the Nicosia city hall (23:48) where we are right now.You have governments at all levels. Thoughts? We need it. Jeffrey Sachs (24:00) said it, we need it.Yeah, no, I mean, he’s from that, you know, philosophy that, you know, (24:08) that we need to democratize, I can’t even talk, democratize the world, that whole liberalization (24:18) economically. And, you know, I think that’s bullshit. And, you know, because I think, (24:29) obviously, people can govern themselves.But, like, if you’re just looking at it from, like, (24:34) a realistic point of view, let’s just take, like, decentralization, for instance, right? Like, (24:45) a step up from, like, anarchism would probably be, like, a decentralized (24:49) society, right? Like, where you have, like, just small governments everywhere. (24:54) Um, this whole idea of, like, a central government that, like, runs the entire world, (24:59) like, could you imagine, like, how out of touch that kind of a government would be with, like, (25:05) with, like, I don’t know, some little town in, like, Indonesia or something, you know, (25:10) like, it’s absolutely insane. It’s an insane thought.It’s pretty much socialism on, like, (25:16) um, it is socialism, really. I mean, from an anarchist standpoint, it’s absolutely socialism. (25:27) But, yeah, central planning, like, from one, you know, one small group of people over an entire (25:34) planet is absolutely insane.Absolutely. They could never match the needs of the individual. (25:40) They couldn’t even match the needs of, like, you know, like I said, some little town in freaking (25:46) Somalia or whatever, you know.You just, you can’t, right? (25:51) Yeah, I mean, like, how do you get this mindset where you’re just like, okay, we have this giant (25:56) national government that’s the United States. They basically tell other countries what to do. (26:01) But the problem, the problem is that they’re just not big enough.Like, we just got to make them a (26:08) little, you know, take over the rest of the world, the other countries that still have some autonomy (26:12) from the United States. (26:13) It’s always like, expand. It’s never like, you know, let’s pull back our power.It’s always (26:21) like, we need to expand our power. We just, we just didn’t do it hard enough. (26:25) That’s, yeah, we’re just, yeah, we’re just not powerful enough, you know.So, yeah, he’s full (26:31) of shit. And it’s crazy, too, because I kind of like Jeffrey Sachs. So, especially like, you know, (26:36) it takes on, like, the war with Russia and what is it? It takes on Israel.But, yeah, I don’t know. (26:47) I always get confused with Jeffrey Sachs and David Sachs. (26:50) Yeah.(26:52) But this guy, he’s an economist. (26:54) And John Mearsheimer mixed up. (26:56) Dude, Mearsheimer’s pretty cool, too.I like him. (26:59) Mearsheimer’s my guy. But what’s interesting is, like, Sachs is one of these guys where it’s like, (27:03) the Shapiros and the Petersons now, where we’re finding is, like, don’t have heroes, guys.(27:09) Just to the point of what we’re talking about. The ideas are mad. The message matters.(27:14) Like, the reason you can’t lock me down or you down on a specific, like, thing is, (27:19) you’re not this. So, you don’t believe X, Y, and Z, because that’s in that bucket, you know, (27:23) the bucket of the left or the bucket of the right or the bucket of the progressives or the (27:28) conservatives or the neocons or anything. But it’s really interesting.So, I’m watching this. So, (27:32) I put up subsidiarity with what that is. I think Sachs is missing it.(27:37) The whole point is to be at the most local level, not to make it global, (27:41) like, to act like it’s neat. No, it’s not needed globally. It’s literally meant to be (27:46) the most minimal level.That’s literally what libertarianism kind of is, because we talk about (27:52) anarchy is not no rules, right? It’s no rulers. It’s governance without government, (27:58) without that structure. So, we still can have these things without the other.And it’s just (28:05) weird that he, once again, he has a lot of it right, and then he jumps that, makes this huge (28:11) leap to somewhere that doesn’t need to go. He’s talking about supersidiarity, not subsidiarity. (28:18) Yeah.There you go. Perfect. (28:20) Yeah, he’s doing it.We should read out Zach’s comment here, because he gave us a nice rant. (28:25) It’s not showing up in the StreamYard chat, but he said, (28:29) what do you perceive is the best non-political, or I guess even political action in persuading (28:35) people toward understanding self-responsibility? How do we persuade people? Because you were (28:42) talking about getting people on board to understand this morality, have a shared (28:51) substance, or whatever it is. What’s the best way to get people there? (28:57) It’s got to start with education, which even that in itself is kind of shitty, because we talk about (29:06) how schools indoctrinate children and whatever, and we’re upset.But you know what? I’d rather (29:12) the school indoctrinate my children to be individuals, and think individualistically, (29:18) and question authority, things like that, than to just bend over and take the big green wingy (29:30) or whatever. You know what I’m saying? It’s definitely got to happen in the schools, (29:37) and it’s got to happen with the parents as a society, though. But that’s not an easy feat.(29:44) So I can’t exactly give a straightforward answer, but yeah, it has to start with education, (29:57) because education is kind of the starting point for… I mean, in sociology or whatever, (30:05) they’ve already found that parents, the first few years of their children growing up, (30:11) parents imprint their political ideologies and religion and stuff onto their kids. (30:21) So the subconscious is between two and seven years old. That’s when most of your actual… (30:26) When you become actualized, when you start realizing what you are, that you’re self-aware (30:30) kind of thing, one or two, to seven is when it’s kind of all baked in.That’s where a lot of that (30:36) subconscious… Yeah. But the problem with that is, okay, what comes first, the education or the (30:41) parents? Well, the parents right now are fucking crazy. So you have to change the education system (30:47) to change the parents in the future, which goes into the whole time preference thing, (30:53) and not with economics, but just in general.Everybody wants change now, but we need more (31:02) of a long march through the institutions type situation, where we’re pushing this stuff (31:07) through the institutions over time. Because I guarantee that none of us are going to see (31:13) the kind of freedom that we want to see in our lifetime. No, like we used to, man.(31:21) You guys are, and it’s… There was so much freedom back then, man. (31:27) Dude, I don’t remember the crazy stuff you used to do as a kid, and the stuff you just… (31:31) I do not remember a single knee pad or helmet with a bicycle or skateboard, none of that stuff. (31:38) It just wasn’t a thing.Now, don’t get me wrong. That’s good, okay? Because I probably have TBI (31:42) all over the place. But the point is… Yes, Mark, you should have worn a helmet.(31:47) Yeah, probably. Thanks, man. But anyway, yeah, it’s like the freedoms are totally… (31:53) It’s totally changing.We’re noticing as that technology ramps up, they’re using it to clamp (31:59) down and Patriot Act. And what they’re doing is they’re going, what do we need in order for (32:06) everybody to accept the new things we’re going to do to them? So then they create the thing (32:12) that they need. It’s the self-licking ice cream all over again, right? Same thing.It’s like, (32:19) it creates the problem that it allegedly tries to solve over and over and over again. (32:26) Yeah. I don’t know.The libertarians, anarchists, whatever, our main goal should be planting seeds (32:34) like Johnny Appleseed, right? Like, just always kind of like bringing up a topic or, (32:42) you know, whatever it is, just always kind of like putting something out there (32:46) to people, right? Like, it doesn’t have to be overbearing or whatever. (32:52) Just through connections, I think. It’s very important that we connect.You know, (32:57) the libertarian party is very toxic sometimes. And that’s something that definitely needs to change. (33:05) You know, it’s just, people are so quick to just completely destroy each other over like the (33:11) smallest little things, you know? But could you imagine like trying to convince society with that (33:17) attitude that like, that they should be on board with your opinions? Like, it’s impossible.(33:24) Yeah. Yeah. Libertarians are like, hey, I think we should have like a little bit lower taxes to (33:31) start with, right? I think Lars maps that he was on this like, hey, let’s start with a flat tax.(33:37) Because of course he believes in taxation as theft. But then everyone’s like, (33:41) taxation as theft, how dare you suggest any tax at all? It’s just like, (33:45) no, you’re going to have to take a step. What I always say is this, like, (33:50) what is theft to you, right? And then usually they’ll come back with something like, you know, (33:56) somebody taking my stuff without my consent or whatever, right? And like, so I’ll be like, okay, (34:04) so do you have a choice when they take your stuff if you’re not around for them to take it from you? (34:09) They’ll be like, no.And I’ll be like, okay, so you don’t have a choice. Well, in this situation, (34:15) you don’t have a choice. They’re taking your money from you.You know what I’m saying? And (34:19) if you would prefer, you would probably want to keep that money. So therefore, what is it? Theft. (34:25) So like, if we can all agree that, okay, maybe you like to pay taxes or whatever, (34:29) but a lot of people don’t like to pay taxes, which means that they don’t consent.So that means that (34:35) no matter what, at the end of the day, even if you like taxes, taxation is theft because other (34:41) people that don’t consent are having the money taken from them. So that’s like kind of how I (34:47) try to explain it to people so that they’re not like, oh my God, you said taxation is theft, (34:53) you’re stupid. It’s like, okay, well, no matter what, like at the end of the day, (34:57) let’s just agree taxation is theft.You can still pay your taxes, fine, whatever. But like, (35:01) it is that. So yeah.(35:04) It’s funny, the first thing you hear is, the first response to that on the Boomer (35:07) social network known as Facebook is, but the rich have to pay their share. (35:12) They’re like, you’re not listening. You’re just not listening to me.Like admitting that they’re (35:19) taking money from you is just admitting that they’re taking money from you. It has nothing (35:23) to do with who’s paying anything more share. You’re still having money taken from you guys.(35:28) You know, it’s crazy. So I do want to share this guys with Justin too. Oh, go ahead.(35:35) Yeah. I agree that the education system is a way to tackle it for sure. It’s not going to be fast, (35:41) but it’s a good way because people have to go to school.They’re required by law to go to school, (35:47) but now they’re getting this indoctrination that will keep leading us further and further down (35:52) the socialist road. So that’s a good way to tackle it. But I was also reminded of like, (35:56) you remember those articles that were like, uh, working out in the gym will make you more right (36:02) wing.Right. And I’m not, I’m not saying that right wing is good, but it makes you more independent (36:09) minded for, for whatever good the right is. They have more of an individualist mindset, (36:14) even though it’s still way on the social spectrum for me.But I would say that just doing something (36:21) hard, like accomplishing something for yourself, something like going to the gym, working out, (36:27) losing weight, building some muscle, that’s going to get you, that’s going to start, uh, you know, (36:33) affecting your mindset to be more independent. Right. You’re like, Oh, I can actually do things (36:38) for myself.I think that would be a great start for a lot of people is just get some exercise. (36:44) You know, easy. Go for a walk.Yeah. Put on Henry Hazlitt’s economics in one lesson. (36:53) It’s like seven hours long.You’ll be walking, you’ll be walking for an hour. You won’t even (36:58) realize it. You’ll be doing that for a week.You’ll have a book read and then you’ll have (37:02) exercise. You’ll get out of the house, get a little fresh air and then just listen to chapter (37:07) 11 about tariffs over and over again. And you’ll be, you’ll be fine.You’ll be fine. (37:13) I want to share this once again. We are, we are here with Jesse, our good friend, (37:17) Jesse over here.Uh, Jesse, can you share your, uh, socials again at June? (37:25) June underscore son one. Yeah. We’re going to type that in the notes.Someone put that in the (37:41) here. So Justin, Justin, first of all, thank you everybody for being here. We’ve got over 40 people (37:47) and it’s another Monday night.It’s not about the woke, right? Even though that’s three weeks old. (37:52) Uh, thank goodness we’re not talking about that today. We’re talking about a bunch of different (37:55) stuff, but this is huge.It’s about the message just about what anarchy is. The, the gentlemen (38:01) that we mean our lives, Jesse, I had the pleasure of meeting at AmFest. Uh, AmFest gave us free (38:06) media access, which I couldn’t believe.I’m like, here, here, I have a ticket. He’s like, cool. (38:10) So we got to hang out with some of his buddies there.Jason, I met, uh, we just had a great time. (38:14) We clicked, we started doing this collaboration F by whiskey and we’re just sharing messages. So (38:23) yeah, exactly.And you guys have known each other for a while. So Justin’s a gentleman. He’s where (38:29) I consider like conservative minded, a little very close to where we are, but it’s like, it hasn’t (38:35) dissonated yet.The dissonance hasn’t cracked, if that makes sense. And he probably won’t ever (38:40) get there, but it’s totally cool. We’re, we’re, we’re good.We’re good people. He’s a good guy. (38:46) He’s awesome.Justin, Justin is amazing because he, he does keep us in line. He’s called us out (38:53) on things. I’ve been like, thank you for checking on that.And he’s definitely, yeah. (38:57) He has some fantastic comments that really keep us like focused and, and get to the heart of the (39:03) question that we’re trying to answer. So it’s very much appreciated.Justin, thank you for being (39:08) here. I guess I’m not one of those toxic, uh, libertarians slash anarchists. (39:14) You’re hoping for a little more toxicity if you could.(39:17) I, I can’t like, it’s not my nature. I mean, I guess it could, but dude, you got to really (39:23) fucking grab my gears, you know, I’ll ship eggs and stuff, but like, I can’t be like, (39:30) even on eggs, I have a hard time meeting people about shit. Like I really understood (39:36) where I’m coming from then.Like just destroy like that bridge, you know? (39:44) But yeah, for sure. For sure. I see.I think what we do is I think, I think I’d like to (39:51) think that we’re pretty welcoming to different ideas. We haven’t, I don’t think we’ve ever (39:55) really shut anyone down. Even if we disagreed, we’ve gone, okay, we see that point because we (40:00) may have felt that point before we see where it was, where it’s been able to be either debunked (40:05) or at least challenged or whatever, things like that.And so, so Jason, do you want to, (40:09) do you want to tackle that guy? Yeah, I’ll read it. Uh, Justin says, do you believe (40:15) that a stateless society, an anarchistic society is one that will ever be able to realistically (40:22) be actualized? What do you think, Jesse? We’ll put you on the spot first. All right.Um, so, (40:31) so anarchism, this philosophy has been around for a long time. I’d say that, um, (40:38) this newest version, at least the anarcho-capitalist version is, is new. Uh, but with that being said, (40:46) because this philosophy has been around a long time, there’s enough people to keep, uh, this (40:52) philosophy going that believe in it.Right. So I think, you know, without, obviously I can’t (41:01) prove it 100%, but I do think that it is possible. Um, it probably won’t happen in our lifetime.(41:10) I’m a realist about a lot of stuff. I don’t think it would happen in our lifetime, (41:14) but I also believe that anarchism is a state of mind first before it’s, uh, an actual, uh, (41:22) real life thing. I think that, you know, you first are the anarchist and then society follows, (41:30) right.Or like this, this like social philosophy follows within society. So first you have to have (41:37) the mindset, right. And then society follows with that mindset.Um, versus like, oh, we’re just (41:45) going to wake up tomorrow and be anarchists. Like, no, we’re already anarchists. We’re just (41:51) waiting for society to have the same philosophy as us.You know what I’m saying? Yeah. Michael (41:58) Malice talks about that a lot, how it’s a mindset and we have anarchist relationships already between (42:06) like the three of us. That’s his classic example is like, we’re on a podcast together.No one’s (42:11) controlling this. Like we’re here by invitation. We’re here because we want to, this is an (42:16) anarchist relationship.You could say whatever you want. And I guess we could get mad if you said (42:20) something we don’t like. Right.But well, and I’d like to point out something. In fact, I was just (42:24) having this conversation cause I was like practicing for the podcast cause I’ve never (42:28) done this before. Uh, so the other day, the night before last, the night before last I went on X and (42:39) did like a lot of, you know, like an X live or whatever.And then I had like this long (42:42) conversation with this really cool anarchist or anarcho-capitalist from Australia. Really cool (42:49) dude. I can’t remember his name off the top of my head right now.But, uh, this came up. So like (42:54) the world itself, all these nations and stuff already exist in a state of anarchism, right? (43:00) Each, each nation being, you know, autonomous or its own like nation, right. Follows its own laws (43:09) as a nation.Doesn’t, doesn’t listen to, I mean, some of them do, but for the most part, (43:17) uh, they don’t, they don’t have to listen to like what fricking this country wants. Right. Because (43:23) they’re their own, their own nation.And then if it comes to blows, then they go to war or whatever. (43:28) So if you think about it on like a, uh, a macro scale, we already kind of exist in a state of (43:35) anarchy, but we have governments within it, like on the more localized scale. Um, and I always (43:42) thought that was an interesting perspective to look at was like the world itself exists in a (43:48) state of anarchy already.So why can’t it be, why can’t it drill all the way down to the individual? (43:57) Right. Well, it’s interesting because people see anarchy is like, there’s like a shootout (44:00) in Houston because a party got out of hand or there’s a school shooting this side. And you (44:05) know, and I’m like, I’m arguing that those things are the effects of the lack of the health of the, (44:09) of the people.Not like, it’s not from like the cultural shift. You know what I mean? It’s like, (44:15) people are unhealthy mentally here. And all these negative things that I see like bubbling up (44:22) aren’t out of like, they’re not, they’re out of like us losing our minds because we just can’t (44:28) keep it together anymore.Not, not for any other reason. That makes sense. (44:32) Right.It’s not like just sticking more police there in that neighborhood is going to solve (44:37) anything. Right. Because I mean, if you think about what the state is, what that concept is, (44:41) is like, they are taking money from people to pay for that, right.To pay for this security force (44:47) that supposedly is there to protect us, but it’s not. Well, they have a choice, they don’t have to (44:54) protect you. Right.So it’s like, oh, we’ll just, you know, we need more police. We need more (44:59) government there to stop it, to keep it under control. And it’s just like, no, if like, if (45:04) people could actually take care of themselves, they’d have some ownership of it.Right. People (45:09) talking about like the middle, this Middle East-West conflict is like us or them now. And I’m like, (45:14) is it an us or them really? Is it really an us or them? Are they going to reach us? Is Yemen (45:20) going to reach us? Like, let’s be, let’s be real here.But even outside of that is like, (45:25) you know, if they were prosperous, they would culturally get like socially more aware. Because (45:32) that’s how prosperity leans. It always leans toward progression.Like it never leans toward (45:38) more authoritarianism. Like never does prosperity lean like in a negative, like in a negative way. (45:44) Right.So why do we have economic sanctions and bomb the heck out of them? Right. We just keep (45:50) them poor. Well, that, that allows that like darkness to kind of keep their foot on their (45:57) throats.Yeah. I mean, prosperity can only exist when freedom flourishes. Right.I mean, that’s (46:03) it. So. Yeah.So on that question, though, well, can it ever happen? I’m not sure. I don’t have (46:13) high hopes for it. I don’t think I will see it ever, but.Just so they know. Freecities.org. (46:21) Yeah. No, but like, just so people understand, like you can be an anarchist and not live in (46:26) an anarchist society.You know what I’m saying? So it’s not crazy to be like, oh, I have these (46:31) beliefs and that’s just what I believe. Right. Like people always be like, oh, you’re anarchist.(46:38) That’s crazy. It’s like, not really. Right.It’s my belief structure. It’s like my belief system. (46:44) And I’m not enforcing it on you.Right. Like I’m just telling you that this is how I feel. (46:49) These are my ideas.Like I’m not, you know, infringing on your, your, you know, need to be (46:55) status or whatever. I think it’s stupid, but I can exist in the same society with you. Right.(47:02) So I don’t think it’s like impossible to think that, you know, sooner or later, maybe a lot (47:09) of people will have the same philosophy as me, you know, and maybe not. I don’t know. But I (47:15) still have this philosophy, whether we’re an anarchist society or not.So. Yeah. Agreed.Agreed. (47:25) Zach says also those perfect worlds exist only in peace and love instead of violence and coercion. (47:33) That’s your point, Jason.You were talking about invitation, right? Was it Peterson that (47:38) talked about invitation as well? It’s like, oh, we want to invite the people coming over. (47:43) We want to be invitational. Yeah.Well, you know. Well, it depends what you mean by voluntary. (47:50) No.Yeah. Right. And I mean, yeah, people should, people should on like the non-aggression (47:56) principle a lot.I’m sure you’ve heard it, but like people do all the time. And I think a lot (48:05) of it was just a misunderstanding. It’s not that like, you can’t be aggressive.It’s just that (48:09) you’re not going to be the first aggressor. Right. Like.Do not tread on me. If you’re going to be (48:15) I will show you. Right.Right. So, yeah, it’s not pacifism, you know, absolutely not. Like, (48:23) I’m always going to be training to be able to defend myself and my family, (48:28) whether I’m aggressive or not, like it doesn’t matter.So. (48:34) Yeah. No, we talked about like a shared morality.I think that’s something important. What do you (48:40) think about that in the context of like immigration and stuff where people are very (48:45) much against immigration because it’s like a different culture? They have different beliefs. (48:51) They don’t think that they’re compatible.If we give them the best, you know, best interpretation (48:56) of their concerns, it’s just that, hey, these cultures are not compatible. What do we do about (49:03) that in relation to like allowing people free movement? Because that would be a libertarian (49:10) principle, right? People are free to move around as they like. But, you know, these cultures are (49:15) clashing.What do we do? I have like movement means citizenship, though. It’s like like do (49:22) I have an issue if someone from Mexico crosses the border daily, works, goes home or whatever, (49:28) or even stays here for months at a time, contributes to society, does nothing wrong (49:33) and then goes home but doesn’t get doesn’t get some kind of funding from us, doesn’t get housing (49:39) from us, doesn’t get health care from us. Do I care about it? I have no issue with someone like that.(49:44) I’ll be honest, like that that person is a zero on my radar. Yeah, right. Well, that’s that’s where (49:48) things have gotten mucked up, right? Like and I blame progressives for this because that’s what (49:53) they do.They have like destroyed the language around immigration. They’ve destroyed it, like (50:01) completely tore it apart because I can listen to Chase, right? Say that he believes in like a (50:07) what was it Ellis Island approach or whatever, you know. But then in another sentence, get mad at (50:13) somebody for saying that they don’t think, you know, that we should just be like flooding the (50:18) border with stuff.And it’s like, OK, well, then what is your stance, right? Like is your stance (50:24) an Ellis Island approach? Because if that’s the case, then you probably agree with a lot of people (50:29) on the situation. And if your stance is like strictly open borders completely and just people (50:35) can just do whatever the fuck they want and like, you know, and then we’re not going to punish them (50:39) if they like, you know, kill somebody or whatever or rape somebody like, you know what I’m saying? (50:44) Like there has to be like. I don’t know, some like some what do you call it? (50:52) Sensibility, right? You know what I’m saying? Like, yeah, we can have open borders, but if you (50:58) murder somebody or you’re you know, you’re doing something with like within the society that (51:04) that’s not accepted, like there’s going to have to be some kind of like ramifications, (51:10) especially if you’re harming people, you know, or stealing their shit or like breaking onto their (51:16) property, which is completely against libertarian philosophy, right? Private property is like the (51:22) top of the pinnacle of rights.So, yeah. Yeah, it would be best to have the border (51:30) literally owned by private properties and let them handle their properties as they are crossed (51:38) or not crossed. Yeah.I mean, look, my biggest problem with the whole thing, right? And I used (51:45) to be like super anti like open border or whatever. I’ve come to be like, OK, you know what? I think (51:52) I don’t I don’t have a problem with the open border thing per se. What I have a problem with (51:58) is when people commit crimes and not like petty theft and shit like that, which is still bad, (52:04) but when people like hurt other people, right, or like fucking break into their houses and stuff (52:11) like that, and then they get off with like a slap on the wrist or whatever, or maybe even not even (52:17) that.Right. Like as a society, like we still need to like punish people that that hurt others. (52:25) Right.We still need to punish people that steal their shit. You know, like you can’t just you (52:32) can’t have one. You can’t have both at the same time.Right. Like you can’t have unchecked open (52:37) borders, but not do anything about the criminals. You know what I’m saying? Yeah.And that’s where (52:44) my problem is. Right. So we need a larger police force.So what you’re saying is. It’s not even (52:50) that. We just need.No, we just need people to equally distribute, you know, I guess the law (53:01) for now equally distribute the law to everybody that breaks it. You know what I’m saying? Instead (53:09) of like, OK, well, these people are immigrants. They can get off easy.But this person over here (53:14) as an actual citizen has to fucking eat shit, you know, like this unequal like. Yeah. Yeah.(53:23) There’s still people, especially if they’re just here working and supporting their family. Who (53:27) cares? Like that’s yeah. Like you said, that’s low on my radar.What I have a problem with in (53:33) the immigration thing is that we are paying. We’re being forced to pay for people to come and flood (53:39) across the border. So if we just cut that off and we’re not only paying for that, but then we pay (53:45) for them to have luxury apartments when they’re here.If we just cut that off, then you solve (53:49) a lot of the problems. Stop stealing money from people. Yeah.The frustrating part about that is (53:55) like so the progressives also believe in open borders, right? But their reasoning for it is (53:59) not the same as the Libertarian reason for it. And like, yeah, it’s easy to say, oh, we agree, (54:05) then we should fucking go march with the progressives on this issue. But no, because (54:09) their purpose for opening the border is to make the government larger.Right? Like they want a (54:15) bigger government. So they’re like, yeah, let them all in so we can break the system and then bring (54:19) about like a bigger government. Like, that’s the point.So if a progressive is like, oh, I believe (54:25) in open borders, too. And then you’re like, OK, let’s fucking march arm in arm and like, you know, (54:31) protest the government enforcing borders or whatever. Like, yeah, you’re only like, you know, (54:38) what is it called? You’re only celebrating your own downfall.Right. Because at the end of the (54:42) day, when the progressives win, like you’re fucked, too. So like, yeah, you might see eye (54:49) to eye on like the open borders, but not for the same reasons.And I think that’s a problem. (54:54) And I think that’s something the Libertarian Party is really bad at. Like, like understanding.(54:58) Well, yeah, it all depends on what you mean by open borders to, you know, you know, sometimes (55:05) it’s like God, you’re not sure what you mean by open borders. And it is true. Like I have a there’s (55:11) a weird thing for me is I believe that a nation is a group of people who have a cultural, general, (55:18) similar identity.And I would like to think United States initially was some kind of liberty (55:24) identity. I that’s what it felt like, at least growing up, at least, but maybe that was all a (55:30) lie. But it feels like that’s what it was.And I think that’s what I’d like to preserve. (55:35) So if that requires like some kind of citizenship to a nation, as a group of, (55:42) you know, like minded individuals of some sort, and you’re welcome to join us, you’re welcome to (55:48) come in and out as you please, you’re you just, you have to just adhere to what we what we do. (55:53) I have no issue with that.But I think the citizenship part for me is like, (55:58) because I culturally agree with that. And I think people we should be accepting people who culturally (56:03) agree with the liberty mindset, not fleeing from a place that we displace them because we bombed it. (56:09) Right now for an economic thing.For example, my my grandfather wrote a guy in Philadelphia to (56:16) to sponsor him and my mom and my aunt, my grandmother, four people never met them. (56:21) He wrote them a letter. And he said, Could you sponsor me? And they left.You know, he was a (56:27) Nazi soldier, then was in East Germany, escaped East Germany. I mean, so talk about political (56:32) persecution, that guy got away from all of it. My grandma should have gone to Argentina.I heard (56:37) that’s that’s where they were very accepting. Right? Yeah, there was a lot of that, too. (56:44) But but but America was accepting of a lot a lot of Germans that had escaped and things like that (56:49) because of the political persecution.But those people wanted to come here for the freedoms like (56:53) they Americanized us. You know what I mean? They had a German club, but they spoke English at home, (57:00) you know, things like that. So it’s like they adopted America as a culture, (57:05) like more of a nation thing.And it’s hard to separate the government from the nation from the (57:10) you know what I mean, from like a citizenship. But I’d love to know that like, hey, we’re all (57:15) like minded people. And you’re welcome in our tribe if you believe in liberty and not hurting (57:19) other people like I think we can at least give you a shot.So you’re welcome to have this piece (57:24) of paper. Yeah, government has taken over the definition of nation. Nation now basically refers (57:32) to the government of a territory instead of what you said, you know, a collective of like minded (57:38) people.Yeah. Yeah, I like it. So here’s some from Justin, if you like, Jason.(57:48) Another problem with the border being open is that those people can be counted in the census, (57:52) which gives those states more seats in the house. Also potential voting fraud. Yeah.Yeah, (57:59) that’s true. That’s absolutely true. Yeah.So people don’t know that the census numbers creates (58:05) the bigger represent. You were going to say that, Jason. I’m sorry.Go ahead. (58:09) No, I was saying the problem is voting. We don’t.We just don’t want people voting. (58:13) I don’t want anyone voting on my stuff. You know, it’s the thing like that’s that’s another (58:19) like example of where I’m like, OK, you know, it’s easy to tell somebody like not to vote, (58:26) like voting is bad, whatever.Right. But like I said, we live in here now and like people do (58:33) care about their own issues. Right.Like if they feel afraid or they feel like a certain way, (58:41) they’re going to vote because they’re going to vote for the guy that they think is going to help (58:45) them. You know, but it’s a personal thing. It’s on an individual level.It’s not our collective (58:51) like. Right. I mean, maybe I don’t tell anyone not to vote, but I think if you want to, (58:57) but everybody could be right.It could be a way to actually get some influence, you know, (59:02) maybe if you’re lucky. One of the real real politic or whatever, like it’s a thing. It’s real.(59:11) You know, like, yeah, it exists. Yeah, you can’t exist. So if we’re stuck with that system, (59:17) maybe that’s your best option.But, you know, if we were in an ideal world, there wouldn’t be (59:24) voting. It’s easy to sit back and be like, oh, I’m just going to move to the woods and I’m going (59:29) to like live off grid and everything’s going to be fine, you know, but the state is big enough now. (59:34) They’ll come touch you like it’s not.It’s not really such a thing really as off grid anymore. (59:40) Like, oh, you didn’t pay your taxes. Cool.We’re going to find you and you’re going to (59:44) fucking pay those taxes, you know, like, yeah, live off grid if you want, but it still doesn’t (59:50) matter. Like they’ve got so much power now that. And the voting thing too.Oh, good. Good, (59:56) Jason. Go ahead.Go ahead. Finish the vote. No, go ahead.What do you have? What were you saying? (59:59) I was going to change the subject. Go. Yeah, go ahead.Let’s change it up. So go ahead. (1:00:04) This is the first year I voted NODA.So like, I totally understand the process of or the progress (1:00:11) of whether you vote or not. Now, I went in the voting booth. There were props on the line.I (1:00:16) still voted on those because I felt those were direct, direct line votes. Those were direct (1:00:21) democracy votes. So I felt those were important.I just felt the people representing me now aren’t (1:00:26) representing me. So I don’t vote for those people. Yeah.If there’s like a proposal for a tax (1:00:33) increase and you can directly vote no on that. Hell yeah. I’m going to vote for that.Exactly. (1:00:37) Right. So all the props I voted on, I just didn’t vote on the people.(1:00:40) I was really hoping I wasn’t going to have to do this, but I got it. (1:00:44) All right. Go ahead.Well, we got 70 people here. We’re going to play Mike Pence and his (1:00:49) awesome acceptance of the award while you’re gone. So you go do what you got to do.Welcome (1:00:54) everyone. Thank you again for joining us on a Monday. Jason, this is the third Monday we’ve had (1:00:59) or fourth or at least over 50.We’re now approaching 70. We had over 100 and some last, (1:01:05) almost 200 both the last two weeks. So it’s been really great.It’s been awesome, man. So thank (1:01:09) you for doing this with me and thank you everyone for being on with us. It’s been awesome.(1:01:17) For sure. For sure. I can’t believe it, man.50 is already crazy. (1:01:22) Yeah. I mean, I’m looking at 70 right now, so it’s pretty cool.So let me play the Pence one. (1:01:27) I don’t think Jesse’s going to need any kind of run up to this. (1:01:32) Nah, I think we’re good.All right. Let me hit this one. (1:01:36) When Jesse comes back, we got Zach’s comment.I think it’s a good one to hit. (1:01:41) Awesome. We will do that.But go ahead with Pence. Yeah. Let me try this.(1:01:49) I’m having some kind of technical issues. Technical difficulties. (1:01:56) It wouldn’t be a live show without technical difficulties.(1:02:01) By God’s grace, I did my duty that day to support the peaceful transfer of power (1:02:09) under the Constitution of the United States of America. (1:02:17) So stunning. So brave.(1:02:19) He won an award for his bravery on January 6th. (1:02:25) January 6th. He defied Trump’s orders and he certified the election in favor of Joe Biden.(1:02:34) He’s a national hero. (1:02:38) Are we playing? Am I putting up the rant from Zach on Rumble? Is that what we’re playing? (1:02:45) Not the rant. He said, do you guys think, at 552, do you guys think that perhaps our government (1:02:52) should continue flooding the border so that we can accelerate the inevitable collapse? (1:02:58) Are you an accelerationist? Are you a collapsitarian? Jesse, you’re muted.(1:03:05) You’re muted, buddy. We do it all the time. It’s okay.Hey, first. All right. Jesse broke (1:03:11) his cherry on muting and talking.Yay. All right. Congratulations, man.(1:03:16) No, because I don’t actually think that’s what’s going to happen. I don’t. I think what’s going (1:03:22) to happen is exactly what the progressives want.I think that just allowing it to happen is going (1:03:28) to expand the power of the government. Why? Because the Republicans and Democrats are both (1:03:33) two sides of the same coin. And whenever either group is in power, the government becomes more (1:03:42) powerful.So I think it matters because what’s going to happen next is the Republicans are (1:03:47) going to be in charge like now. They’re going to start passing more laws about the border, (1:03:52) more laws about everything else for our safety. And yeah, the accelerationism is just going to (1:03:58) lead to more authoritarianism.I don’t think it works the way people think it does. I’ve never (1:04:06) seen like a situation where it has worked that way. I mean, I don’t know about you guys, but.(1:04:12) I know. I do think it would slowly get worse. And maybe like after 100, 200 years, (1:04:19) maybe things would finally get bad enough to collapse.But I think that- (1:04:22) Yeah, but there’s a collapse. What comes out of the collapse is another- (1:04:27) Right. Another government.Exactly. (1:04:30) And it’s not American based, guys, because they’re not American mindset coming here. (1:04:35) No, I’m more of a controlled exclusion person.(1:04:38) Yeah. I think as dumb as our government is, the people in there are smart enough not to go full (1:04:46) state control, like full 100% communist state control over all industry because they just (1:04:52) don’t want to. They don’t care.Not everyone. I will say people like James Lindsay and there’s (1:04:59) other people like him are just like, oh, everyone’s a communist. Everyone’s a Marxist.(1:05:03) Oh, God. (1:05:03) It’s just like, they’re really not. They’re like maybe fascist.(1:05:06) These are going to get cut off and try to run the damn show. (1:05:08) So are we going to start the woke right three? (1:05:11) Yeah, let’s hit the woke right, man. We might as well.We’re here. We’re here. (1:05:14) Since you brought up James Lindsay.(1:05:16) Not everyone’s a communist though. You know what I mean? They’re just like, (1:05:19) they’re happy with the system where they can take money from these private corporations and (1:05:24) do what they want. (1:05:25) I don’t know, man.There’s a lot of communist stuff there. I’m just kidding. (1:05:28) I do think Trump definitely sent a signal to stop and we’ve definitely seen border crossings.(1:05:36) We’ve definitely seen migration up here stop, right? There’s been a signal sent. (1:05:41) Now, I’m not saying that he’s the right or the left or whatever. The right wants people here for (1:05:48) they want cheap labor.The left one I’m here. I’ve got a suspicion that they want to turn them (1:05:53) into military and they want them to be like a federal military presence while they send our (1:05:59) boys and girls overseas to die in other wars. And that’s how they migrate us.And that’s their path (1:06:04) to citizenship. And when they’re not connected to this country and they’re like, I will grant (1:06:08) you citizenship. If you point a weapon at these other citizens of yours that you don’t even know, (1:06:14) of course, you’re easier to do that.(1:06:16) It’s so easy to do that because they’re not your people. (1:06:19) Much harder for me to point my gun at my neighbor than it is for someone who crosses the border (1:06:24) for me to go. If in order for you to be a citizen, you have to point your gun at this (1:06:28) other citizen of ours to keep them in check.Think about it. Who was it? Chuck Schumer had (1:06:33) said it or no, Dick Durbin. Who is it that we need to turn them into military? We need military (1:06:38) people.I really think that’s the move that they’re trying to do. (1:06:44) So I try not to use the term right and left as much anymore because I think it’s just way (1:06:50) too simplistic for how complicated politics is and how complicated people are as individuals. (1:06:58) But with that being said, this whole thing about like Democrats, they’re not all like (1:07:09) socialists in the way that you think of socialists.I mean, obviously, I think a lot of (1:07:13) people are socialists that don’t think they’re socialists. But that aside, one of the main (1:07:21) things that Democrats have, and if you go back and listen to Chuck Schumer and stuff back then, (1:07:27) is that they are capitalists. However, their liberal outlook has been painted.(1:07:43) Does that make sense? So classically liberalism, open borders, (1:07:51) classical liberalism, definitely open borders. They definitely believe that a larger influx of (1:07:59) people is going to boost the economy by creating more jobs, creating more opportunities. (1:08:06) And then globalism, globalization.So they do believe in that stuff. A good portion of the (1:08:14) Democrat Party believes in that. I mean, if you really look at what Joe Biden did when he was in (1:08:19) office, it’s very in line with some of the classically liberal points.I think where the (1:08:30) problem lies is that they’ve become tainted by the socialist left or the progressives, right? (1:08:38) The progressives are pretty much socialists. We call them progressives in the US, but (1:08:41) I mean, that’s pretty much what they are, right? Progressing towards socialism. (1:08:46) Yeah.So they’ve tainted that. They’ve tainted that party. Whereas conservatives are different (1:08:51) because conservatives can be socialist, right? Because what is conservatism really, right? (1:08:58) It’s like conserving family values, right? Conserving tradition.None of those things (1:09:06) have to do with economics, right? If your tradition is socialism, then you’re conserving (1:09:11) socialism. Is that what I’m saying? Conserving the status quo of 10 years ago, which was- (1:09:16) Remember, we’re talking about how we use that too. If we use state power to control the narrative or (1:09:22) to control the thing, it’s all socialist, right? Right.So it’s really easy to be like, (1:09:27) Republicans are conservatives, blah, blah, blah, blah. But I think it’s way more complicated than (1:09:33) that. And I think as far as conservatives go, Marx called them bourgeois socialists, right? (1:09:42) They were conservative, but they were also socialists.But because they weren’t left-leaning (1:09:47) socialists like Marx was into, he called them bourgeois socialists, yet they still had the same (1:09:53) economic philosophy of socialism. They just, they were conservative. Whereas Marx wasn’t (1:10:00) a conservative.What did he call it? He was all about the continuous (1:10:08) changing progressive society. His political labels are like Starbucks drinks, (1:10:14) double half-calf, triple-calf, naff, naff-calf, double-calf. And calf.(1:10:21) There you go. By the way, great show today. I missed the live, but I did catch it right after.(1:10:26) Good show talking about your stuff, even though you had some mic issues. (1:10:30) I was listening. (1:10:30) Even the pros have issues.(1:10:31) You never get it right. (1:10:35) Everybody check out ANCAF and check that out. ANCAF number seven, (1:10:40) go on at DropTheMassPod on X. He’s got them all in there.(1:10:44) Go on Rumble. I cleaned up the audio a little bit. It’s better.It’s not great still, but it’s (1:10:49) better. Just put on your budget, guys. You’ll be fine.(1:10:55) We never got into the woke right thing. (1:10:59) Okay. Woke right.Yes. Sorry. We’re getting distracted here.(1:11:03) I’ve been wanting to talk about this, because I’m very upset with James Wooden, (1:11:07) because I spent so much time defending this dude. It’s heartbreaking. Anyways, (1:11:19) he’s the reason why I decided to go back to school, why I decided to go to college and (1:11:26) basically jump into the lion’s den of what this indoctrination center is like.You know what I’m (1:11:33) saying? It’s hard for me to watch him fall into this. As far as woke right is concerned, I think (1:11:46) in some ways, he’s right. In a lot of ways, he’s wrong.To me, woke right is pretty much like (1:11:54) McFluent is. The reason I say that is because the whole nationalist or white nationalist movement, (1:12:05) if you remember, the Nazis were socialists. Socialism is predicated on the whole dialectical (1:12:17) approach.However, for normal society, the dialectical approach is on an individual level, (1:12:26) whereas we look at things as in us versus who’s oppressing us personally, like our boss fucking (1:12:35) sucks or whatever. With people like McFluent is, they’ve turned it into a collective conscious. (1:12:48) Marx was talking about this idea of collective consciousness.His collective consciousness is (1:12:54) the white race or whatever. You know what I’m saying? This whole idea about white people are (1:12:59) being oppressed by black people and brown people or whatever. That to me is woke.If you read any (1:13:07) of the literature that came from critical race theory, Herbert Marcuse and all these other people, (1:13:17) especially Marx, it totally fits. Then let’s not forget that many of Hitler’s economists, (1:13:28) if you ever read The Road to Serfdom, Hayek lists actual quotes of Hitler’s economists (1:13:42) talking about how they respected Marx and stuff like that. It’s not a stretch to say that McFluent (1:13:50) is woke.The stretch is where you start putting everybody else into that box. What happened with (1:13:58) the Israel thing, and I witnessed this personally, was when it first happened, I was so fucking pissed. (1:14:04) I was hurt watching those people just being slaughtered or whatever.I was so upset about (1:14:10) that. I’d get into fights with these people that were like, fucking Jews, blah, blah, blah, blah, (1:14:15) and I was like- Talking about October 7th. (1:14:18) Yeah.I was like, what does that have to do? What does their religion have to do with, (1:14:22) what does them being Jewish have to do with anything? Then it all starts to make sense. (1:14:29) But then other people come along and they’re like, well, Israel is fucked up because now (1:14:34) they’re bombing the shit out of Gaza and flattening it to the ground. You can see that (1:14:40) shit on Google Earth, it’s so fucked up.It gets to the point where like, okay, yeah, (1:14:46) they’ve gone super overboard and yeah, it’s bad. It’s super bad. They’re killing all these (1:14:54) innocent people just to get one guy.I don’t see a problem with being upset about that. (1:15:04) James Lindsay just went in, all in on this woke right thing. I think personally that he (1:15:12) developed this theory and he’s afraid to be wrong.Just like in colleges where professors (1:15:21) will take all this time building a theory and then- That’s what actually woke is, in my opinion. (1:15:26) And then when someone comes along and questions it, they’re like, how dare you? I’m a specialist (1:15:33) in my field, whatever. And they’ll hold that progress in their field because of their (1:15:42) unwillingness to be proven wrong about what they’re saying.So I think he’s just full of (1:15:48) himself and it’s just really fucked up to watch. What I think happened though, if I may, Jesse, (1:15:54) if I may try to color in the shades. I don’t know, maybe it is some things.(1:15:59) You have to do this though. I’m going to use my fingers, (1:16:02) I’m going to dance in the middle as I talk about God. So what I’m thinking happened is- (1:16:11) Clearly, Nick Fuentes is anti-Semitic.He’s just literally just a white supremacist. (1:16:15) He’s a straight up Nazi. (1:16:20) So that’s fine.In this one instance, the anti-war crowd is aligned with this Nazi racist (1:16:29) piece of shit. That’s what’s happened. Lindsey is a Zionist or he’s a neoliberal, aligned with (1:16:38) the Zionists.There’s some Zionist agenda and that’s just what it is. It’s not a Jew thing. (1:16:45) We know it’s not a Jew thing.It’s a nation state, whatever they’re doing, they’re trying (1:16:51) to control that narrative back. And there has been a systematic attack on these people who are (1:16:57) aligned and they use Nick Fuentes, the most radical, to represent Dave Smith. That’s where (1:17:04) it gets silly to me.Well, I think it’s even more simple than that. I think he’s just brainwashed, (1:17:11) to be honest. I know that.I’m just saying how Lindsey is using it though to lump us together (1:17:17) because he’s trying to make the anti-war part. I think he’s trying to taint the anti-war people (1:17:22) because it is anti-Israel in this one respect, the anti-war and anti-Israel. (1:17:27) Sometimes I don’t even think there’s a conspiracy theory about this shit.I sometimes think people (1:17:32) are just either brainwashed or just… You think he knows a lot, but you can’t know everything. (1:17:43) You can be a specialist in your field, but sometimes you still have bad opinions about (1:17:50) other things. And to me, his opinion about that is it’s just that he probably lived his whole (1:17:57) life hearing Israel’s the greatest ally to the United States or whatever.But for me, (1:18:05) I asked myself, because I went to Afghanistan. I never saw one fucking Israeli while I was there (1:18:13) fighting beside us. You know what I’m saying? Whereas these people would be like, oh, they’re (1:18:19) the greatest ally.And I’m like, but how? What do they do? You know what I’m saying? (1:18:29) Right. But the point I’m actually making is I’m not saying Lindsey is… He’s all individually (1:18:33) might be individually thinking this, but all of a sudden within a week, we’ve got this lineup of (1:18:39) people all of a sudden getting on Rogan all lined up, being able to say all this stuff. It seemed a (1:18:45) more coordinated.It was weird. They had this crazy circus thing where they were going on every (1:18:53) podcast. Yeah.That is kind of weird, but I don’t think it’s all that way. I really don’t. I really (1:19:02) don’t think James Lindsey is… I appreciate your perspective because I’m happy to overcorrect on (1:19:06) the most crazy side.I got a lot of tinfoil, so I’m good. I don’t think he is. I think his whole (1:19:14) career was like he touched on a very important topic.And then I think this just derailed him (1:19:20) the way it derailed a lot of people. It really did. It split apart the Democrat Party.It split (1:19:28) apart Republicans. The issue itself, I think, is a lot deeper. And it’s burnt into people’s (1:19:36) psyches that Israel is our greatest ally, and we must protect them, even though there’s no… (1:19:44) You know what I’m saying? Yeah, of course, we can be mad.I believed that growing up my whole life. (1:19:48) I did too. Of course, we can be mad that Israelis got killed.Of course, I’m upset about what (1:19:55) happened. And then you also have to understand that this idea of terrorism that we have is (1:20:03) subjective. And a lot of times, when these people actually perform terrorist attacks, (1:20:12) it’s not because they’re trying to cause terror necessarily.A lot of the times, (1:20:17) it’s because they want something to happen back. So they did this because they knew Israel would (1:20:25) go overboard. And that’s a well-known fact about terrorism, is that they knew that Israel would do (1:20:35) something worse back and go overboard, and it would change the whole world’s entire view on (1:20:43) what was happening.That was the main purpose for this. It had nothing to do with terrorizing (1:20:48) Israelis. It’s fucked up, but that’s why I said terrorism is subjective.To one person, (1:20:56) it’s terrorism. To someone else, it’s a whole different thing. So you gotta be able to look (1:21:02) at these things.Remember, Osama Bin Laden was a freedom fighter in the 80s. (1:21:05) Right. So you gotta be able to look at these things, is what I’m saying, from different angles, (1:21:11) I guess, different perspectives.You can’t just be like, oh, they’re the bad guys. (1:21:16) Right? Obviously, it was bad. There’s no question.But what was the purpose? To me, (1:21:26) I really believe the purpose was to get this result from Israel, because now it’s changed (1:21:32) the entire conversation. That’s kind of a messed up thing to do in itself. It’s like, (1:21:39) we know that Israel is going to retaliate.We know they’re going to slaughter our people. (1:21:43) That’s why it’s horrible. It’s horrible, because it’s affecting the people that live there that (1:21:48) had nothing to do with it.It puts Israel in a really fucked up predicament that if they didn’t (1:21:54) do anything, they would look like shit for not protecting their people. There had to be a (1:22:01) response. There had to be a response.But at the same time, it’s like I said, (1:22:06) it’s a very tricky situation, because what do you do? If you do the worst thing, you’re going (1:22:13) to look bad. Why did the Palestinians feel like they had to do that? Why did Hamas feel like (1:22:18) they needed to do that? Because they are being held down. I feel like they timed them with a (1:22:29) reason.I also think that Israel is a little bit new. Remember, they extended the concert. (1:22:35) It’s right next to the thing.They saw people were training for months ahead of time. They (1:22:40) acted like they didn’t know. There are reports all over the place about that.What was happening (1:22:46) is the Abraham Accords were using all the other Muslim countries to squeeze out the Palestinians. (1:22:54) If you listen to Bibi, he even says it, and there’s multiple times where Americans say it, (1:22:58) why are we fighting with the 20% Palestinians who are the ones holding it all back? (1:23:03) But they’re the oppressed. They don’t have a nation state.They don’t have anything yet, (1:23:07) even though they’ve been freed since 2005, allegedly, with no economic sanctions. (1:23:14) They’re being starved to death right now, by the way. They have that.They were getting squeezed (1:23:19) out. It was a last desperate attempt. It’s my opinion.They needed the world’s eyes on this, (1:23:24) and this was their lash out moment to get the attention that they needed to break that (1:23:30) Abraham Accord part or to stall it in some way. That’s what desperate people do. (1:23:37) Terrorism is the less power people doing what greater powers do to other nations.(1:23:44) They use bombs and guns too, right? It’s not right. It’s not ethical. (1:23:49) It’s not justifiable, but- (1:23:50) Not at all.(1:23:51) But you have to be able to look at it through a critical lens, right? (1:23:58) Yes, and you have to live in those shoes. (1:24:00) You have to. I guess that’s woke.You got to look at it through a critical lens, (1:24:08) like pick it apart and understand what both sides are going through. (1:24:12) How to follow the science. (1:24:15) That is science though, right? (1:24:18) It is.Totally is. Like I said, (1:24:20) science is proving everything wrong because that means it’s definitely not that. I love (1:24:25) finding out that stuff’s not right.It’s beautiful. (1:24:29) I don’t know if you guys have seen James Lindsay recently. He unblocked me, by the way.(1:24:33) He blocked me for a day, but I’m back. (1:24:36) Nice. I’ve been blocked for a while.(1:24:37) Did we whine? What happened? Did we make some kind of movement? (1:24:41) I’m not sure, but he’s talking about a new thing he calls woke libertarian. (1:24:46) I don’t know if you guys have seen this. (1:24:47) Oh, Jesus Christ.(1:24:48) It’s a critical government theorist, someone who will make common cause with the woke right, (1:24:56) but someone who uses their skepticism of government to frame everything (1:25:02) in the government is bad frame, I guess. (1:25:08) It’s not bad. (1:25:09) What is literally bad is the libertarian mindset.(1:25:13) Government is bad. If there was a motto, it would be government is bad. (1:25:17) How is that woke libertarian? That’s just libertarian.(1:25:21) It’s not even new. (1:25:25) Philosophy’s been around longer than James Lindsay’s been alive, (1:25:27) so I don’t know what the fuck he’s talking about. He didn’t come up with some new- (1:25:33) Is he Sam Harris on us? Did he break right instead of break left? (1:25:37) Did he just break right? That’s what we’ll call it.The broke right and the broke left. (1:25:42) Oh, my God. There it is.We have a new term. (1:25:45) Oh, sorry. Good, Jesse.I apologize. I’m just getting more and more angry with this. (1:25:52) Yeah.I think a lot of it’s personal to him. I think he’s lost his empirical resolve, right? (1:26:02) His perspectives, kind of? (1:26:04) Yeah. Looking at things from a scientific perspective, he’s become very reactionary (1:26:12) about shit, I guess.I don’t know. It’s fucking sad to watch. I used to cheerlead for that dude (1:26:20) because I really felt- It is sad.Yeah. (1:26:22) He was onto something, man. I’m not going to throw out everything he’s done or said.I think- (1:26:30) No baby out with the bathwater. No, take the good ideas with you, for sure. (1:26:34) I can’t.That’s how it works. That’s how philosophy works. That’s how the philosophy (1:26:39) of science works.We might not be happy with what so-and-so said. We might think Aristotle (1:26:46) was stupid on some shit and we did. We took the things that he created that were good and we moved (1:26:52) forward with them.Every time some philosopher comes out with something new, we pick it apart (1:26:58) and we bring forward the stuff that works and we throw aside the stuff that doesn’t. (1:27:03) Yeah. (1:27:04) Because you have to, otherwise you stagnate, right? You can’t stagnate as a society.(1:27:10) You don’t go anywhere. So, yeah. (1:27:14) Yeah.I think he just took a wrong turn. He’s not wrong about everything. It’s just like, (1:27:19) he took this way too far with the woke stuff.(1:27:22) Yeah. 100%. (1:27:25) Libertarians, are you not allowed to be critical of any structure of power, of any system? Because (1:27:31) if that’s your definition, then okay.I guess we’re all woke. (1:27:34) Well, you have to be, right? (1:27:35) Yeah. (1:27:36) I don’t know.(1:27:37) I mean, it literally is what it is. Decentralized. Wait a minute.You’re a woke libertarian. Well, (1:27:43) what do libertarians believe in? Decentralization. Oh.(1:27:47) Yeah. (1:27:48) Wait a minute. (1:27:49) This guy.(1:27:50) I just want to play that real quick. Only because Zach said it, we’ll play this clip next, (1:27:57) just because it’s fun. (1:27:58) Yeah.Good timing. (1:27:59) All right. (1:27:59) Yep.(1:28:02) I just want to look at what we look like from abroad. Again, both from friends and enemies. I (1:28:09) think it should be of grave concern that Russia has gotten happier and happier every time they’ve (1:28:20) contemplated this series of own goals we scored on ourselves.And the communications from the (1:28:27) and on Russian television. I mean, just after that Zelensky press conference, (1:28:34) if Trump isn’t a Russian asset, one wonders how he could do a better impression of one, right? (1:28:41) I mean, he’s doing exactly what Putin would want. Yeah.I mean, the Bukele moment was just (1:28:51) just despicable for its own reasons. I mean, it was all right on the surface. You had the president (1:28:59) kind of laughing over the fate of a man sent to effectively a gulag in El Salvador, (1:29:06) who the administration admitted had been sent in error.Right now, maybe they’re now backpedaling (1:29:11) on that confession. But at the time, that lawyer was acknowledged by what was that? (1:29:16) That lawyer was fired, the one who mistakenly said the truth. (1:29:21) At the time that he yet had not been denied.Right. It was just everyone knew that he was sent in (1:29:27) error. But it was still a an object of comedy for the president and the administration that (1:29:35) he was there and no one had the authority to get him back.It was just awful. And again, it’s awful (1:29:44) by virtue of the fact that we can no longer even pretend to hold the moral high ground. I mean, (1:29:52) we’re not we’re not on the side of of democracies and open societies struggling to (1:30:01) be free.Right. We’re just we’re patently not. We’re on the side of authoritarians who we can (1:30:05) cut a deal with.It’s it’s very dark. We’re on the side with the authoritarians we can cut a (1:30:17) deal with. Isn’t that every foreign policy since World War Two? Yeah, this is nothing new.(1:30:25) You can say what you want about Trump, but God, just the whole Russian asset thing. (1:30:31) That’s really why I wanted to play this is because it’s so like this clip is from last (1:30:37) week. I think this is not from 2016 when everyone was saying Russia, Russia, Russia.(1:30:42) He still hasn’t got over the oh, it’s Russia collusion. Oh, he’s working with Putin. He’s (1:30:47) a Putin puppet.It’s just, bro, you need a new playbook. Well, as much he might be right about (1:30:54) the immigration stuff and the guy they sent to El Salvador that wasn’t supposed to go. He might he (1:30:58) might be right about that.Well, we have a process issue with that for sure. Yeah. To start out with (1:31:03) Russia is just like, dude, you’re not you’re not getting it.Yeah. Like, where did these people (1:31:13) come from? Like, why is Sam Harris so important? Like, that’s a great question. Not just Sam Harris, (1:31:20) but like all these people, like, yeah, they’re podcasters or whatever.But like, why? Why do (1:31:25) their opinions matter so much to people? Like, I always wondered that, you know, like, I don’t (1:31:31) know, maybe I’m just weird, but he’s an expert. Admittedly, Sam Harris was expert in what? (1:31:37) So, so just a little older because Hitchens, if you guys don’t know Hitchens that much, (1:31:43) Christopher Hitchens was this new atheist. Like, I was agnostic atheist.So like when I came across (1:31:50) this group of brilliant minds who had really good ideas, not all of them are good. But if you notice (1:31:57) those four, those four horsemen of the apocalypse, Hitchens kind of lost it during Iraq, right? (1:32:03) But he was like, well, we’re already interfering anyway. So you might as well go the whole hog.(1:32:07) It’s not like he was for it. He was just like, we’re freaking doing it anyway. Right? Like, (1:32:12) so Hitchens is weird though, but he kind of lost, you know, we kind of lost it right at the end.(1:32:18) Dawkins, Dawkins definitely is losing it as he’s got his imperialistic stuff. (1:32:26) The, uh, was it right? Samuel, uh, the, the meme guy, right? Um, cause he’s talking about Israel (1:32:32) cause talk about Israel, the old guy who’s, I don’t believe in cultural Christianity. (1:32:38) Is that, isn’t that Dawkins, right? And then you’ve got obviously Harris who back then, (1:32:44) and once again, Jason, you and I like free will.We thought that was a pretty decent book to listen (1:32:49) to and go, okay, that makes sense. But without counterarguments, it does make sense. (1:32:54) The second we see these pushbacks, he literally snapped and broke.That dude has total Trump (1:33:00) derangement syndrome. He ain’t coming back. He ain’t coming back.The right embraced him a little (1:33:05) bit after he went on Bill Maher’s show and was talking about, um, radical Islam. And he was like, (1:33:11) there’s actually a problem here, guys. And then everyone on the right was like, oh, okay, let’s (1:33:16) listen to Sam Harris.That’s when I started listening to him a little bit. And that’s the (1:33:21) Ben Affleck clip when Ben Affleck started accusing him being racist. But Sam Harris at the time (1:33:27) without, without context, the Muslim faith has a jihadist, whatever.Okay. Okay. If you’re telling (1:33:33) me that enough, I’m going to believe it.Like whether, whether that’s true or not, I’m just (1:33:37) going to believe that you told me that. So it’s real. So like, you’re just fear mongering to be (1:33:42) completely honest.That is not a compelling argument. Fear mongering isn’t logic. That’s (1:33:46) not reason.So like that once you know, yeah, for him, it was more just like, he didn’t like (1:33:52) religion at all. And he’s like, Hey, this religion has problems just like other religions. And (1:33:59) everyone was like, oh, you can’t say that.Yeah. Yeah. Like he did a thing about mother Teresa (1:34:04) being evil.Like he went full, they went full anti like religion big time. Yeah. It was like (1:34:10) their thing.Yes. And then once again, don’t have heroes, have good ideas, pick the good ideas from (1:34:16) those people and move on. That’s it real simple.Yeah. These guys just become so self-important, (1:34:23) you know, like, like self-important one day that’s my goal. Did you have that opinion? (1:34:30) You’ve never been, you know, like, like the self-important shit.It’s so annoying because (1:34:37) it’s like, who the fuck are you? Like, I didn’t even know who you were. You should at least have (1:34:41) the courtesy to visit the region. Who you are telling me how I should think, you know, like, (1:34:48) no, no, we’re not doing that.So yeah, I’m going to pick and choose the stuff that I like about (1:34:57) your opinion or, you know, the stuff I don’t. And I’m not going to look at you like some kind (1:35:01) of hero because I don’t even fucking know you. You know what I’m saying? You’re not a hero.(1:35:07) And, and one, a big one for me is Peterson. Jordan Peterson’s a real big one. I think snap, (1:35:13) like, I honestly think he’s the psychopathic narcissist that he’s warning everybody about.(1:35:19) Like it is not, it is not that far from it, but I feel like it’s that way with all of them because (1:35:25) the more and more like popular they’ve become, like the more they’ve become like super self (1:35:32) absorbed and not willing to listen to anybody else’s thoughts and quick to like jump on everybody (1:35:39) else for having a different opinion. And it’s like, no, like you’re no longer thinking rationally (1:35:47) anymore. It’s just, yeah.I was trying to, I was going to try to clip it earlier today, (1:35:52) but I can’t get some of these clipping things to work right now. But literally we saw last week (1:35:58) where we did the woke, right? Stuff to just circle back where Peterson was talking about (1:36:03) the narcissism about crisis King stuff. I just watched Russell brand today.Talk about Christ (1:36:10) being King. And then you sit there and you watched you on Peterson and Russell brand kneeling (1:36:15) together, praying during the anti-war movement thing. Remember, can I pray with you? Remember (1:36:20) that whole thing? And then you’re like, who’s the narcissist, crazy person connecting with the guy (1:36:25) who said crisis King, your, your same guy is said crisis King, your guy, the guy that you’re (1:36:30) praying with.And you’re calling up Candace Owens of all people, Candace Owens, who’s a mother, (1:36:36) a loving mother of like four children now that she’s having her fourth on the way or something. (1:36:40) Are you kidding? How does this happen? What he, he was a family values, like all that stuff. And (1:36:45) then Michaela visited like Andrew Tate, the tape brothers and hung out with them.(1:36:51) Mind blown. Like, I don’t even get it, man. We’re in a simulation, right? (1:36:57) That might be the moment that made Peterson snap.It’s seeing his daughter. (1:37:02) Is this like, is this a real world or is this like some real simulation? (1:37:07) No, it’s a lesson that we all had to learn. We all have a lot of people still need to learn (1:37:12) is that you just, you can’t have these heroes of people.You can’t do it. You know, they’re (1:37:17) going to let you down at some point. The message is the important part.(1:37:22) Take a message away from people. Like, don’t listen to Jason. (1:37:25) Join a group because of the person join because of the ideas, right? If you believe in something, (1:37:31) it shouldn’t be because you’re in this cult, this club of like, I got to be in here because all, (1:37:36) all these people are here.They’re cool. No, it’s, is it because of, are you principled? (1:37:40) Do you believe in what you’re actually saying? I think most people don’t think about it. They’re (1:37:45) more into the joining a tribe, being part of the cool club.You know, it’s, it’s not really about (1:37:51) ideas or, or principle or anything like that. Right. I think that we’ve, I’m glad that Zach (1:37:59) guy is a narcissistic psychopath for joining us.Good. So I always, when I hear the word (1:38:08) principle, I always think it’s, you know, it’s really easy to say like principles are like (1:38:13) awesome. You know, you need to have principles, but like what principles, right? Cause like (1:38:18) everybody has their own.Uh, so, so, so people are always like, oh, he’s a principled guy. (1:38:25) And it’s like, okay, but what is principled? I can assure you, Douglas Murray is very principled. (1:38:34) 100%.Oh, I’m sure. Yeah. He’s very principled.(1:38:38) My principles are we’ve never met a war we don’t like. (1:38:41) Yeah. I think principles are individualistic too.Like where you have your own principles, (1:38:46) but that doesn’t mean that they necessarily match everybody else’s or whatever, you know? (1:38:51) So yeah. Yeah. I guess my point is people get more sucked into bad principles because of people.(1:38:59) They joined the, you know, the cool club because there’s cool people there. (1:39:02) They adopt the bath water with the baby. (1:39:08) Is what you’re saying? (1:39:09) Yeah.That’s it. Yeah. (1:39:13) I totally get it, man.So what do we have next, my friends? (1:39:17) Speaking of principles, maybe we can go onto the Trump tariff stuff. We can talk about the movies. (1:39:24) Trump is apparently, uh, he’s considering, or maybe already did it.I don’t know. He’s, (1:39:30) he’s saying that, uh, this is a national security threat that foreign movies coming (1:39:36) into our country are a big problem, a big problem. They’re terrible.(1:39:41) You know, Mr. Trump, Mr. President, I’d like to say that Canada really does profit (1:39:46) greatly from having movies up there. Please don’t take them away from Canada, Mr. President. (1:39:55) That was your cue, Jason.(1:39:57) That was it. (1:39:58) No, that was your cue, man. (1:40:00) I’ll hit the clip.I wasn’t ready. (1:40:02) All right. (1:40:02) All right.(1:40:03) The movie tariffs. (1:40:05) Yeah, the movie tariffs, what they’ve done is other nations have been stealing the, (1:40:11) the movies, the movie-making capabilities from the United States. (1:40:15) And I said to a couple of people, what do you think? I’ve done some (1:40:19) very strong research over the last week and we’re making very few movies now.(1:40:24) Hollywood is being destroyed. Now you have an incompetent, (1:40:27) grossly incompetent governor that allows that to happen. So I’m not just blaming (1:40:32) other nations, but other nations, a lot of them have stolen our movie industries.(1:40:37) And I’m saying, if they’re not willing to make a movie inside the United States, (1:40:42) then we should have a tariff on movies that come in. (1:40:45) And not only that, governments are actually giving big money. I mean, (1:40:49) they’re supporting them financially.So that’s sort of a threat to our country in a sense. (1:40:53) And, uh, it’s been a very popular thing. (1:40:57) I can tell you one thing, movie makers love it.(1:41:01) Hey, what do you think about that? Foreign countries making movies, (1:41:09) that’s a big threat to us, right? (1:41:12) It’s always like this random shit that’s a threat to national security. (1:41:18) So like, I took your national security- (1:41:21) Do you be more random? (1:41:22) I took national security last semester and like, you’d be surprised what the stuff they’re like, (1:41:28) this is a threat. Global warming is a threat to national security.(1:41:34) I mean, you name it, you know what I’m saying? Like everything’s a threat to national security. (1:41:39) And because it’s a threat to national security, we need more government, right? (1:41:43) Like we need more intervention, like this stupid as shit. (1:41:46) Like, and people just go along with it.They’re like, oh my God, (1:41:49) that’s the national security of global warming is a threat to national security. (1:41:52) Then we need to like, you know, we need more FBI agents. (1:41:55) God, what the fuck do they have to do with anything? (1:41:58) I like how he says, like they’re taking our ability to make movies.(1:42:04) Other countries somehow take our ability to make movies. (1:42:08) That is just some ridiculous nonsense. (1:42:11) I don’t think it has anything to do with that because I think what’s happening is (1:42:15) we are becoming like so decentralized, right? At a really fast pace.(1:42:21) That like the music industry, the movie industry, (1:42:25) all these industries are becoming like outsourced to like everybody, right? (1:42:31) Like you can freaking make a movie on your computer now that probably has like somewhat, (1:42:37) you know, the same quality as like a regular movie that you would see in theaters. (1:42:43) Or you can record a song for your album on your computer by yourself, right? (1:42:49) And you don’t need a record label or, you know, or even a band, you know? (1:42:57) So like everything is becoming super decentralized, right? (1:43:00) Even crypto, like crypto started like Bitcoin, Ethereum, whatever. (1:43:04) Now it’s like fart coin and fucking shark coin.(1:43:08) You know what I’m saying? (1:43:10) Right? (1:43:11) Trump coin. (1:43:12) You can literally go, you literally press a button (1:43:14) and create your own crypto token like instantly. (1:43:19) That’s how crazy it is now.(1:43:21) Sping a wits, Jesse. (1:43:22) You got some exciting news. (1:43:28) So a lot of work went into it, but most of it, (1:43:32) most of the work that went into it didn’t go into making the coin.(1:43:35) It was just like making the website and stuff. (1:43:37) But yeah, so I created ANCAP coin. (1:43:43) Sooner or later it’ll move, but it’s more about creating a conversation (1:43:47) or starting a conversation.(1:43:49) I think it’s pretty cool. (1:43:50) I’ve been making all these memes with it. (1:43:53) I’ve been getting a lot of followers also making memes with it.(1:43:57) So, you know, it’s whatever. (1:43:59) If it goes somewhere, that’s great. (1:44:01) If it doesn’t, it’s fine too.(1:44:04) But yeah, people are buying it a little bit. (1:44:06) So I’m cool with that. (1:44:09) Well, here’s the thing interesting, like about movie sets.(1:44:12) I know Jason will get back, but it’s like, (1:44:15) I know it’s gotten very expensive to like film in cities. (1:44:19) So they started moving to like suburbs and whatever, (1:44:22) but then it got cheaper to move in Canada. (1:44:24) And it’s like, that’s how the free market works.(1:44:26) And we’ll go overseas. (1:44:28) I’m like, oh, let’s make a vacation and pair the vacation. (1:44:30) We’ll make it like something more enticing (1:44:32) for someone to want to film there and blah, blah, blah.(1:44:34) So they do all these different things to entice all these people. (1:44:37) That’s how free market works. (1:44:39) My question is, what is 100% tariff on a movie set? (1:44:43) How do you, how do you, how do you like per, (1:44:47) oh, it would have cost a million dollars in Pennsylvania (1:44:50) and it costs 300,000.(1:44:52) So your tariff is 700,000. (1:44:54) Like what, how does that work? (1:44:59) Plus look at the American movie industry. (1:45:01) Seriously, like this has been the center of propaganda (1:45:06) for the US government, right? (1:45:08) This has led us to a bad place.(1:45:10) We do not want Hollywood having full control (1:45:13) over the movie industry. (1:45:14) Legacy, right, just asked the question (1:45:16) about how I made the token. (1:45:18) I just used pump.fun. (1:45:21) It was pretty easy.(1:45:24) But I’m actually starting to experiment (1:45:29) with like JavaScript and stuff. (1:45:31) I’ve already created several other tokens (1:45:34) on the Solana blockchain (1:45:36) and with a little bit more stability and stuff. (1:45:40) So I don’t know, sooner or later, (1:45:42) I’ll probably have a lot of cool stuff (1:45:44) to create, but yeah, that one was really easy.(1:45:48) It was the website building (1:45:50) and everything else that was not so. (1:45:52) Very cool. (1:45:54) So I want to piggyback off that Trump thing (1:45:56) with the movies.(1:45:57) Like when will people realize (1:46:00) the government is not our parent? (1:46:03) It is our child. (1:46:05) Like people don’t get this. (1:46:07) This is like the biggest thing.(1:46:08) I think that’s the epiphany people don’t get. (1:46:10) It’s like, we need a daddy. (1:46:12) We need a government.(1:46:13) We need that thing. (1:46:16) And if you look at Trump, (1:46:17) Trump has been acting (1:46:18) like a stern father figure, right? (1:46:20) We’re doing this. (1:46:21) We’re pushing forward.(1:46:22) We’re going to be great. (1:46:23) We’re going to blah. (1:46:25) Okay.(1:46:25) He’s like, you know, (1:46:26) square peg in a round hole or whatever. (1:46:28) Okay. (1:46:29) People like the action stuff, (1:46:30) but you all, the three of us, (1:46:32) no, he is not our father.(1:46:34) He’s us. (1:46:35) He’s gotten our father to the point where, (1:46:37) Jason, what does he tell us (1:46:38) what’s going to happen next? (1:46:40) He’s going to tell us so much (1:46:42) how many toys we can have next. (1:46:45) Yeah.(1:46:45) You don’t need 30 dolls. (1:46:48) Okay. (1:46:48) You’re going to have three or four dolls.(1:46:50) You’re going to be very happy. (1:46:51) That’s all you need. (1:46:54) So this is daddy Trump, (1:46:57) Papa Smurf, whatever.(1:46:58) I don’t know what you want to call him. (1:47:00) Papa Drumpf. (1:47:01) And he is going to tell us (1:47:03) how our Christmas is going to be (1:47:05) for our children.(1:47:06) And you’re going to like it. (1:47:07) Talk about the tariffs. (1:47:09) And I want to ask you about something (1:47:10) you said this week.(1:47:11) Got a lot of attention. (1:47:13) You were at your cabinet meeting. (1:47:14) You said, quote, (1:47:15) I’m going to quote what you said.(1:47:16) Maybe the children will have two dolls (1:47:18) instead of 30 dolls. (1:47:19) And maybe the two dolls will cost (1:47:21) a couple of bucks more (1:47:22) than they would normally. (1:47:24) Are you saying that your tariffs (1:47:26) will cause some prices to go up? (1:47:28) No, I think the tariffs (1:47:29) are going to be great for us (1:47:30) because it’s going to make us rich.(1:47:32) But you said some dolls (1:47:33) are going to cost more. (1:47:33) Isn’t that an acknowledgement (1:47:34) that some prices will go up? (1:47:36) I don’t think a beautiful baby girl (1:47:39) needs, that’s 11 years old, (1:47:41) needs to have 30 dolls. (1:47:44) I think they can have three dolls (1:47:45) or four dolls, (1:47:47) because what we were doing with China (1:47:49) was just unbelievable.(1:47:50) We had a trade deficit of hundreds (1:47:52) of billions of dollars with China. (1:47:55) When you say they could have three dolls (1:47:56) instead of 30 dolls, (1:47:58) are you saying that Americans (1:47:59) could see empty store shelves? (1:48:02) No, I’m no, I’m not saying that. (1:48:03) I’m just saying they don’t need (1:48:05) to have 30 dolls.(1:48:06) They can have three. (1:48:06) They don’t need to have 250 pencils. (1:48:08) They can have five.(1:48:11) But how do you know (1:48:14) how many fucking pencils I need (1:48:16) on a trade deficit with China? (1:48:19) I’m a sketch artist for the police department. (1:48:25) God, this shit pisses me off. (1:48:28) This is bad.(1:48:29) Trump, Trump has turned out (1:48:30) to be actually very, very bad. (1:48:31) I thought he would be like, (1:48:33) OK, like he’s definitely (1:48:34) going to be bad on some things, (1:48:36) but maybe not so much on others. (1:48:38) Economically, he’d probably be better.(1:48:40) No, he’s turned out to be worse. (1:48:43) He’s terrible trash. (1:48:45) Yeah.(1:48:47) Excuse me, excuse me. (1:48:49) You’re in no position to tell us (1:48:51) how many dollars we need. (1:48:54) Literally, he’s like, (1:48:55) he’s literally the father says, (1:48:57) don’t don’t do as I do, (1:48:59) as I say, not as I do.(1:49:00) That’s literally what he is. (1:49:02) Yeah. (1:49:04) That’s yeah.(1:49:06) I mean, I kind of ragged on Lindsay (1:49:09) for saying everything socialism, (1:49:10) but this is him being quite socialist. (1:49:14) Yeah, well, I mean. (1:49:18) Yeah.(1:49:21) I don’t know. (1:49:23) This whole situation is just like, (1:49:26) I don’t even know if it’s a letdown. (1:49:28) I don’t even know if I expected anything else.(1:49:31) I guess I kind of had hope, (1:49:33) but I just, you know, (1:49:35) after the 2020 election, (1:49:37) I was kind of like, (1:49:38) you know, I don’t think this dude is the answer, (1:49:42) you know? (1:49:44) I really don’t. (1:49:45) I’m glad I voted for him the first time. (1:49:47) I will say.(1:49:49) We thought we thought that Iran (1:49:51) would already be bombed, (1:49:52) but to Trump’s defense, (1:49:55) I think a couple people said, (1:49:57) let’s not do that. (1:49:58) So he kind of did defy Bibi a little bit. (1:50:01) Look, we got to play this (1:50:03) the way it’s going to play out, right? (1:50:04) So I’ll give him the point.(1:50:05) Like he freed Ross. (1:50:06) OK, cool. (1:50:07) Well, he did this.(1:50:07) That’s not cool. (1:50:08) Well, he did this. (1:50:09) That’s cool.(1:50:09) OK, so let’s do a point by point. (1:50:11) He does do this. (1:50:12) He does push back.(1:50:13) He does put out the covid.org website, (1:50:16) which I’d like to show (1:50:17) with the Jeffrey Sachs thing in a second, (1:50:18) which is hilarious. (1:50:20) What this what Jeffrey Sachs (1:50:21) had to say about covid, (1:50:23) which is crazy town. (1:50:25) But Jeffrey Sachs, once again, (1:50:27) same guy who we just talked about earlier, (1:50:29) who does who is expertise (1:50:31) because he’s been there.(1:50:34) But we have all these things (1:50:35) and it’s like it’s just crazy stuff. (1:50:38) So any any other point (1:50:39) before I continue, guys? (1:50:43) Go ahead, go ahead. (1:50:45) All right.(1:50:46) So this is once again, (1:50:48) Jason, your whole thing, (1:50:49) drop the mask is because of covid. (1:50:52) Well, covid won’t let go. (1:50:55) We still don’t know what’s going on.(1:50:57) Now, my understanding is this (1:50:59) and this is the timeline I have. (1:51:00) Covid happens like September ish (1:51:03) is really when it gets out. (1:51:05) A couple people get sick.(1:51:06) They shut down the database. (1:51:08) Then they have those weird (1:51:09) military games they had in October (1:51:11) where a bunch of people got sick (1:51:13) and allegedly some Italian. (1:51:16) Military people got sick (1:51:17) and brought it to Italy, (1:51:18) and that’s when it really got bad in Italy, (1:51:19) because like everybody lived there (1:51:20) and they were old (1:51:21) and lived together and all that.(1:51:22) That was like covid 1.0 (1:51:24) and that’s when it started spreading. (1:51:25) So my understanding is (1:51:26) that timeline was back then. (1:51:28) But to hear this thing (1:51:30) where it originated is pretty crazy.(1:51:31) Have you? (1:51:32) Have you guys both heard this (1:51:33) or seen this yet? (1:51:35) I have seen this. (1:51:36) Yeah, you see. (1:51:37) Have you seen this yet, Jess? (1:51:38) OK, now they’re ready.(1:51:40) Do you have socks on, Jesse? (1:51:41) You should put some on (1:51:42) because you should be ready (1:51:43) to get them knocked off. (1:51:46) I’m good. (1:51:49) Also, a little surprising.(1:51:51) And I have to admit. (1:51:53) I’m 99% sure. (1:51:58) But my view based on (1:52:01) very extensive work (1:52:04) over the last four and a half years (1:52:08) is that covid came from (1:52:12) the University of North Carolina, (1:52:15) which is the leading researcher (1:52:17) on beta coronaviruses, (1:52:20) working with the US government (1:52:22) on a set of grant proposals (1:52:25) that identified putting in (1:52:29) the viral change (1:52:30) that created SARS-CoV-2.(1:52:33) It’s a grim truth. (1:52:34) It’s ugly. (1:52:36) It’s been hidden from view.(1:52:38) The reason I mention it (1:52:40) in this context is (1:52:41) we don’t have any global governance (1:52:45) that is effective right now (1:52:47) to control the manipulation (1:52:49) of dangerous pathogens (1:52:52) like the manipulation (1:52:53) that created the pandemic. (1:52:57) And when it happened (1:52:59) and officially it took (1:53:00) seven million deaths, (1:53:03) but probably if you count (1:53:07) all of the deaths (1:53:08) associated with covid, (1:53:10) it was probably closer (1:53:11) to 20 million deaths. (1:53:13) Even when that happens, (1:53:15) it’s never properly investigated.(1:53:17) It’s covered up. (1:53:19) It’s hidden from view. (1:53:21) This is a big claim.(1:53:23) It’s the first time that I hear it. (1:53:24) Can you tell us a bit more about this? (1:53:26) How and why? (1:53:33) I just want to point out (1:53:34) the look on that guy’s face (1:53:35) when he said that, (1:53:36) because it was like, what the fuck? (1:53:43) Wow. (1:53:44) Yeah.(1:53:44) Interesting claim. (1:53:47) The virus came from (1:53:49) North Carolina University. (1:53:53) Having watched a lot (1:53:54) of his videos and stuff, (1:54:01) I kind of want to believe him.(1:54:04) I don’t know. (1:54:05) It doesn’t seem like the person (1:54:06) that would just like (1:54:07) destroy his own reputation. (1:54:10) Just to say some shit.(1:54:12) You know what I’m saying? (1:54:13) Like he speaks in front of the U.N., (1:54:16) you know, like two weeks ago, (1:54:18) he was in front of the U.N. (1:54:19) talking about Ukraine and like. (1:54:23) But the ramifications of that. (1:54:27) I mean, does it change much? (1:54:29) Because we kind of suspected (1:54:31) that the NIH was involved with this, right? (1:54:34) Like, at least they put (1:54:36) the research over in Wuhan (1:54:38) where it leaked out of.(1:54:39) That was kind of the accepted (1:54:41) understanding, more or less. (1:54:44) Right. (1:54:44) So, I mean.(1:54:47) It originated at UNC. (1:54:50) I mean, originated means (1:54:52) a lot of things, right? (1:54:53) Like maybe the way to do it (1:54:55) was created there (1:54:57) and then they actually did it Wuhan. (1:54:59) But if they actually did it at UNC, (1:55:02) then transported it to Wuhan.(1:55:06) Now we’re talking a different (1:55:07) kind of creation story, right? (1:55:09) Like those are two very different. (1:55:10) Trying to blame China for everything. (1:55:12) Well, you know, like hindsight, (1:55:15) I kind of remember China saying that (1:55:17) or accusing the U.S. of starting it.(1:55:20) So accusing the U.S. (1:55:23) of dropping it in China. (1:55:26) Right. (1:55:27) Technically they did, right? (1:55:29) Technically now they did.(1:55:30) But I mean, how many anthrax claims, (1:55:32) all these other claims, E. coli, (1:55:34) all these other weird ones (1:55:34) were from these lab leaks from all over. (1:55:37) And he talks about global governance again. (1:55:39) And you’re like, dude, (1:55:40) how did they handle it last time? (1:55:43) Yeah, that’s the big point of all this, right? (1:55:46) This is the context of his earlier comments (1:55:49) we looked at of, (1:55:50) we need a big global government (1:55:52) to control this, right? (1:55:55) That was the context.(1:55:57) That was really the point of all this. (1:55:58) So maybe, yeah, it came from UNC. (1:56:01) I don’t know.(1:56:01) It could have. (1:56:02) It sounds believable. (1:56:03) Sure.(1:56:04) But the point he gets to is, (1:56:07) oh, well, if we just had (1:56:08) a big government to control this, (1:56:10) we could have stopped it. (1:56:11) And that’s just not true. (1:56:13) That’s absolutely not true.(1:56:15) Failing upward again. (1:56:16) It’s like, how many times (1:56:18) can we keep giving more power to failure? (1:56:20) You know what I mean? (1:56:22) And now, before we call it, guys, (1:56:24) because I know we’re hitting up on two hours here, (1:56:26) but before we call it, (1:56:27) we’ve got this scene. (1:56:28) I’d love for you to set up, Jason, (1:56:29) because I know you saw it.(1:56:30) But look who’s on the side of the people (1:56:32) who are trying to control us. (1:56:35) Whoa. (1:56:37) Look at this awesome guy.(1:56:38) Oh, yes. (1:56:41) So this guy was a journalist. (1:56:45) Have you seen this one, Jesse? (1:56:47) No.(1:56:47) All right. (1:56:48) The White House Correspondents Dinner. (1:56:49) I think you’ll get a kick out of it.(1:56:51) You’re going to love it. (1:56:52) We’re running out of time. (1:56:53) Run out of time.(1:56:54) I’m going to play it right now. (1:56:58) We journalists are a lot of things. (1:57:00) We are competitive and pushy.(1:57:02) We are impatient. (1:57:03) And sometimes we think we know everything. (1:57:06) But we’re also human.(1:57:09) We miss our families (1:57:10) and significant life moments (1:57:11) in service to this job. (1:57:13) We care deeply about accuracy (1:57:14) and take seriously the heavy responsibility (1:57:17) of being stewards of the public’s trust. (1:57:20) What we are not is the opposition.(1:57:23) What we are not is the enemy of the people. (1:57:26) And what we are not is the enemy of the state. (1:57:34) Interesting contradictions.(1:57:35) Yeah. (1:57:36) Go ahead, Jesse. (1:57:37) Yeah.(1:57:37) Not enemy of the state, the journalists. (1:57:42) Yeah. (1:57:42) So much for what do we call it? (1:57:44) The fourth state or whatever.(1:57:47) Right. (1:57:47) The one that’s supposed to like (1:57:48) keep everything in check. (1:57:51) Yeah.(1:57:52) Yeah. (1:57:52) Not the enemy of the people. (1:57:53) We’re not the enemy of the state.(1:57:55) What are you? (1:57:57) What are you? (1:57:58) Yeah. (1:57:59) All right. (1:57:59) Well, we got a minute before we call it.(1:58:02) Thanks again, everyone. (1:58:03) We almost made it to 90 people again, man. (1:58:05) This has been awesome.(1:58:06) Jesse, thanks for joining us (1:58:08) for a couple hours on a Monday night. (1:58:10) Jason, as always, thank you. (1:58:12) Closing thoughts, Jesse and Jason.(1:58:15) Thank you. (1:58:17) You can go first, Jason. (1:58:19) Ah, just yeah.(1:58:20) Thanks for joining us, Jesse. (1:58:21) It’s been a blast. (1:58:22) We’ll have to do this again.(1:58:23) Everybody follow Jesse. (1:58:25) JeJune underscore son one on X. (1:58:28) Follow me at Drop the Mask Pod. (1:58:30) Follow Mark Sean Pulse on X. (1:58:33) We hit 90, guys.(1:58:35) I’m going to hit it out. (1:58:35) Well, let’s talk a little bit offline. (1:58:37) Thank you to everyone who joined us tonight.(1:58:39) It’s been such an honor (1:58:40) that this last couple of weeks has been great. (1:58:43) Thanks so much, guys. (1:58:44) Have a great night.